''We live in a world in which we need to share responsibility. Then there are those who see the need and respond. I consider those people my heroes.'' Give them ways to express their rage without hurting themselves. That's what the world needs.
Freddie`s World
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 23:46:33 (MST)
ahh, the observer finally speaks with its true intelligence
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 21:05:28 (MST)
Mr. Observer, I submitted the previous posting on your behalf. As an Anonomous contributer, you have no credibility here, even to those who may share your views. So you might as well be saying ......Blah Blah. Greg
Puna, HI USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 21:01:11 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
funny..its called observer, it doesnt observe.... shows how "not" intellegent it is
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 16:06:13 (MST)
Honee...Don't you have a company to run. LOL!!!
Gently <jsinger@uwm.edu>
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 15:24:12 (MST)
-----------“The Legend of Captain Bravo”----------------------------------------------- Long ago, there lived a sailor named Captain Bravo. He was a manly man's man, who showed no fear when facing his enemies. One day, while sailing the Seven Seas, his lookout spotted a pirate ship, and the crew became frantic. Captain Bravo bellowed, "Bring me my red shirt!" The First Mate quickly retrieved the captain's red shirt, and while wearing the brightly colored frock, the Captain led his crew into battle and defeated the pirates. That evening, all the men sat around on the deck recounting the day's triumph One of them asked the Captain, "Sir, why did you call for your red shirt before battle?" The Captain replied, "If I am wounded in the attack, the red shirt will not show my blood. Thus, you men will continue to fight, unafraid." All the men sat in awe and marveled at the courage of such a manly man's man. As dawn came the next morning, the lookout spotted not one, not two, but TEN pirate ships approaching. The crew stared in worshipful silence at the brave Captain and waited for his usual orders. Captain Bravo gazed with steely eyes upon the vast armada arrayed against his ship, and without fear, turned to the First Mate and calmly shouted, "get me my brown pants!"
Joe Campbell <vva324jfc@aol.com>
wauwatosa, WI USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 13:59:07 (MST)
>>>>>An Open Message to the Observer>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Don't speak unless you can improve on the silence for every word either invites or distances"!!!
Joe Campbell <vva324jfc@aol.com>
Wauwatosa, Wi USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 13:39:55 (MST)
Ho hum, Ho hum, Ho hum, Ho hum, Ho hum. Observer..you write in english, how come you don't understand it??? ou-ya are-na ot-na anted-wa on-na is-tha ite-sa. o-na ody-ba ares-ca any-na ore-ma!!! ou-ya uck-sa!! ale-ga
Clinton, In US of A - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 13:27:55 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
- Observer Post Removed -
- Observer Post Removed -
ALVIS: Thanks for the info! FRED and GALE: Thanks for the photos! Commo has gotten a bit heated lately, but one can hardly be surprised: all this constant war talk on t.v. is probably having a negative emotional effect on most combat vets, and things tend to come out sideways. I had to laugh at the news the other night about the eighty year old man in England who got his call-up orders from their DOD; it got me thinking about signing up for the coming conflict, but I also realized that I'd probably just slow things up on the trip to Baghdad — they'd have to stop every couple of hours to let me pee...
Max Whittington
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 12:48:46 (MST)
Fred A. that is funny ROTFLMAO.
Rick England
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 12:39:11 (MST)
Just one more with a metaphor in the message (twice) ----------------------The Astute Donkey----------------- One day a farmer's donkey fell into an abandoned well. The animal cried piteously for hours as the farmer tried to figure out what to do. Finally, he decided the animal was old and the well needed to be covered up anyway; so it just wasn't worth it to him to try to retrieve the donkey. He invited all his neighbors to come over and help him. They each grabbed a shovel and began to shovel dirt into the well. Realizing what was happening, the donkey at first cried and wailed horribly. Then, a few shovelfuls later, he quieted down completely. The farmer peered down into the well, and was astounded by what he saw. With every shovelful of dirt that hit his back, the donkey was doing something amazing. He would shake it off and take a step up on the new layer of dirt. As the farmer's neighbors continued to shovel dirt on top of the animal, he would shake it off and take a step up. Pretty soon, the donkey stepped up over the edge of the well and trotted off, to the shock and astonishment of all the neighbors! Life is going to shovel dirt on you, all kinds of dirt. The trick to getting out of the well is to not let it bury you, but to shake it off and take a step up. Each of our troubles is a steppingstone. We can get out of the deepest wells just by not stopping, never giving up! Shake it off and take a step up! Remember the five simple rules to be happy: 1. Free your heart from hatred. 2. Free your mind from worries. 3. Live simply. 4. Give more. 5. Expect less. Special Note: Also, the donkey kicked the shit out of the guy that tried to bury him. Which brings me to another moral for this story: When you try to cover your ass, it always comes back and gets you! Peace Brothers & Sisters - GB- Joe
Joe Campbell <vva324jfc@aol.com>
Wauwatosa, WI USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 11:11:47 (MST)
Brother Joe, Funny stories! Remind me of a similar one where the Boss goes out on the loading dock of his company to find a guy sitting on a pallet smoking a cigaret. Pissed off, the boss asks the guy "How much do you make? The guy answers "300 bucks a week". The boss peels off several bills and giving them to the guy says "heres a weeks pay, now get the hell out of here". After the guy leaves the boss goes to the forman and asks "how long has that ass worked here?" The forman replies "he doesn't, He was making a delivery". Ha Ha. To answer an earlier question from judith, I went to my first two years of High school at Brookfield Central and have some fond memories of Wisconsin. Hope you guys are snug. Gotta go to work, Regards, Greg
Puna , HI USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 10:53:14 (MST)
> > A man and a woman, who have never met before, find themselves >assigned to the same sleeping room on a transcontinental train. Though >initially embarrassed and uneasy over sharing a room, the two are tired and >fall asleep quickly-he in the upper bunk and she in the lower. > > At 2:00 AM, he leans over and gently wakes the woman, saying, >"Ma'am, I'm sorry to bother you, but would you be willing to reach into the >closet to get me a second blanket? I'm awfully cold." > > "I have a better idea," she replies. "Just for tonight, let's >pretend that we're married." > > "Wow! That's a great idea!!" he exclaims. > > "Good," she replies. "Get your own damn blanket." > >
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 10:38:03 (MST)
STREET, MD USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 08:23:08 (MST)
Criticism There was an old man, a boy and a donkey. They were going to town and it was decided that the boy should ride. As they went along they passed some people who thought that it was a shame for the boy to ride and the old man to walk. The man and boy decided that maybe the critics were right so they changed positions. Soon they passed some more people who thought that it was a real shame for that man to make such a small boy walk. The two decided that maybe they both should walk. Soon they passed some more people who thought that it was stupid to walk when they had a donkey to ride. The man and the boy decided maybe the critics were right so they decided that they both should ride. They soon passed other people who thought that it was a shame to put such load on a poor little animal. The old man and the boy decided that maybe the critics were right so they decided to carry the donkey. As they crossed a bridge they lost their grip on the animal and he fell into the river and drowned. The moral of this story: If you try to please everyone, you will eventually lose your ass.
Joe Campbell <vva324jfc@aol.com>
Wauwatosa, WI USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 07:26:11 (MST)
Brother Mark and all my "Brothers: Sometimes in life we need just a little break and here is one for all to ejoy and share. Keep up the communication. We all have a lot to share and a lot to get over. This serves as a wonderful place to do Both. So here goes: It's called: "Give Me a Break” I went to the store the other day, and I was in there for only about 5 minutes. When I came out there was a damn cop writing out a parking ticket. So I went up to him and said, "Come on, buddy, how about giving a guy a break?" He ignored me and continued writing the ticket. So I called him a pencil-dicked nazi. He glared at me and started writing another ticket for having worn tires! So, I called him a piece of horse shit. He finished the second ticket and put it on the windshield with the first. Then he started writing a third ticket! This went on for about 20 minutes... the more I abused him, the more tickets he wrote. I didn't give a shit. My car was parked around the corner. Try to have a little fun each day. It's really important!! God Bless us All, Brother Joe - Milwaukee
Joe Campbell
USA - Friday, February 28, 2003 at 07:19:41 (MST)
Mark, is Dee ok? Thats a wonderful lady u have there and wishes the best of health to her and to u .
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 21:34:15 (MST)
......No Fred...it wasnt "Your Crows feet"......or "Just Stoned to the Bone" that I saw in your eyes. It was the look of a Vietnam vet that sat in the Pop-A-Top, but was 10,000 miles away, and 30 years ago away. I love you "BROTHER".......as I said. I wasnt there. but I have seen that look to many times before, to not recognize it.The way I taught myself to recognize it, was to study the look of Larry's eyes in the photos that have been sent to me from his budies that were with him in Vietnam........I'm sorry for all of this.........always a brother,.........Mark.......Judith!!!!!!!!!....so nice to hear your voice tonight!!!!!!!!Love to you and Joe........................
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 21:08:41 (MST)
Freddie`s World well I guess not. But I`ve never been one "lost for words". Things has always came easy for me, when thrust in a "group situation". I could always emerge as a leader or top dog somehow. But today was a sometimes you get the bull and sometimes you get the horn day, and been building. I just couldn`t seem to make the 129th AHC easy. So everybody come back and heal up and move on with your lives. It`s almost like a cult rather than a brotherhood. And that`s not a insult for god sake. So I`ll let this go and we call it a TKO. Because I can`t change and I not one to feel sorry for myself. I love who I am....it serves me well. But it works agaist the grain for you all. Only thing that worries me is my eyes, Mark your sure thats not my "crows feet" or I was just "stone to the bone". Never been told that one before. So do what Greg said to do, the Hawaiian thing. Freddie`s World is done, but I`ll be back . I just got to take a break. I`m burned out on this, it`s to much work.
Fred Skaggs <ac459429@earthlink.net>
Raleigh, NC USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 20:41:55 (MST)
Animal.....well then it's Ho's Pono Pono then.............you be the one that sent me the two sand blasted glass drops. You sent me a blue one called the Sea Turtle, and an red one called the rasin' sun. I wear them on my riding vest and am asked all the time where I got them and what do they mean. I say they are from you, but as to what they mean, as far as to me, they are priceless and there are no words I can say that can really explain what they mean to me. I went to the sight you sent in here to view your work. Wondering if I could comission you to do a piece for the Pop-A-Top. Something from your mind that you create on your own that would mean something that all of us would understand. Nam involved, brotherhood, and friends, Healing and the such..............always a "BROTHER".....Mark
Mark Jackson <gourfour@bright.net>
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 20:11:27 (MST)
The Hawaiians call it Ho'o pono pono. It means to come together and work things out. It ain't quick, it ain't easy, and it's not going to be all lovey dovey. What it is though, is healing, and the only ground rules are honesty and respect. On top of that, it's going to be painful,but like they say; "no pain no gain..." Some may not feel they need healing, but here they are, interacting and relevent. Lets thicken up our skin and not be so sensitive. The venting and emotions are important.whether we like to admit it or not this sight is a virtual group therapy session. As far as Bush Bashing goes, it comes with the turf. There hasn't been a president that I can remember who wasn't "bashed". So my Brothers, as my friend Aretha says:" R. E. S. P. E. C. T...sockittome,sockittome. Aloha, Greg
Puna, HI USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 19:54:55 (MST)
....Well Freddie Boy......ya have finally done it this time. I have been setting back watching all the talk going on, along with receiving negative emails from others about how you tend to debate, or attack anything that anybody says in here and try to make them change their way to the life that is Freddies World. Hell man, I mentioned something about Rap...........................................................................................mmmmmmuuuss,,,,,huh.....sorry, just cant use those to words together, and you lectured me on that.............and you do, and have gave me lots of shit in here......that never offended me. I looked at you as a "BROTHER", something that you think nobody in here is, just because in Freddies world, you dont look at us that way. All these people , who now I am siding with , with their comments on this matter, and you, are my "BROTHERS and SISTERS"...you mentioned that these people in here are, "just good friends".....sorry to hear you say that Freddie. I have more love from this sight of brothers and sisters then I ever had in my life before from my real brother and sister. I love them, and they are my family. Instead of standing alone, you should open up and embrace us as brothers and sisters. We do to you. Try it, you might like it...This is the home of the 129th AHC. Not a place to debate anything.......and Freddie.....as far as you leaving Vietnam behind, you forget "BROTHER", I have met you, and have looked into your eyes. I saw it, you also, relive everyday.......so dont try and bullshit me about that. I wasnt there, but have met many that have been and have seen the look in your eyes. It always the same, distant. I saw it in yours.............................Lets all try and even the wieght out on the ship and fly striaght........the last month has saddened my heart and I know that Larry has not liked what has been going on either. he did not come to me for this place to end up in the disaray that it has. All that used to come in here, please come back. All that choose not to, thats ok also. But please continue to read the postings. This place was created for you all, and "IS" a place to come and heal..............I am not that smart of a guy, and do not claim to know all about everything, and have been puzzled and heart broken ever since this all has come about............I do not have the answer to everything and will never claim to, including this matter that has gone on in here. I really dont know what else to say about it. I just hope this senseless bickering will stop.....as I said. I am not the ruler of this place in space, I am only the creator, but hope and pray in the future that this place returns to the happy home that it was, I can not stop somebody from coming in here and saying what they want to. I will leave it up to all of your consciences to know when and what you are saying that might hurt somebody in here. If you have to, do that crap on the back channel........now if you dont mind, I have a very sick wife I need to tend to....................I am not mad at anybody, just disgusted and disappointed. This is not why I stared this place...............goodnight..........your "BROTHER".........Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 18:55:07 (MST)
what i said to u fred, i said as a brother, without anger.U do have a place here and i am glad u are here, as u have some good imput.Just please stop bashing people is all i ask.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 18:01:50 (MST)
max, great idea about the b- 52s,chuckle. "Pop a top" is a neighborhood bar , located in a small rural town in western ohio.Guess the largest town closest is muncie indiana.The bar has a "motiff" of helicopter and nam parafanaila.It has a flight suite on the wall,chicken plate, a rotor hanging from the cealing,along with a russian sks (1956) , a law,and many many more things.Most of the things there came from the 129th members and one spirtual part owner.you see max,the bar is owned by a fellow named mark. His brother is a 129th member.his brother,Larry,was kia within 24 hours of his 21st birthday.He had taken ray grangers place on that flight as a favor.ray had to be somewhere.you know how it was..one minute ur going to fly, the next u have to do something else.Pop a top is the spirtual home i guess, of the 129th.Mark and his wife are wonderful people that will greet you with a grizzle sized bear hug.There is no place in that bar u can look without seeing something the will stir a memory. Kokomo Indiana has a yearly reunion of nam vets, put on and hoasted by,nam vets.Last year,(please help me here folks) 13 thousand vets attenteded.Its in an old corn field, out in the country.Must have been a million flags flying,camp fires everywhere, groups of brothers, reunions, folks serching for there units and people they served with.It last ..maybe a week, not sure, i was there only 3 days.Those of us in here that were there,sat and stood around a campfire, sipping beers or drinks of choice. Lots of laughs,warm feeling and descussions of things of little value. Some even tried to fly a kite.There is live music there (good stuff too), vendors selling food, beer, hats,,, u name it.Most stay overnite in town,as the sanitation opitions are somewhat limited to "port a potties" and no bathing opitions at all.Surpriseing me, in all that drinking,there wasnt one bit of trouble.NONE. Security is there, but its pretty laid back.I cant remember the cost of entry,thinks it was like 5 or 8 bucks,earning a ribbon that allowed you entry all days after that.If you go. and we hope u do, u will need what u drink,some food perhaps,,tho they had one heck of a spread there already ( ty u all again for that). You might also include a rain coat and whatever u smoke.As i live only an hour away, i came home once a day to shower and take care of my animals.I did spend the night in my car too.>> cheap ass. there were vets from all over the usa there,lots of units.as a side note..the 173rd has a large group there also.They are grunts,but we dont hold that against them,,chuckle.There unit had many ops. where we did. They too have adopted PopaTOP has theirs.They hold a wonderful xmas party there with a standing invatation to 129th members. oh, the town pop a top is in, is Cold water ohio.Others in here can give u lots more info on kokomo, my knowledge is very limited on that subject.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 17:54:18 (MST)
Well maybe when I burn my bridges I burn them good. I have always had lots people that care about me. I think you probably feel better now getting all those things about me off your chest. Never really felt that welcome anyway, has nothing to do with anyone here. My life is good so I don`t need to keep finding a cause to champion. But I can`t deal with the stuff that goes down here. Thought for a while I was making a "break thru" it can never be the same after today. I join the "silent minority". Fred sounds like this did you some good, but it does nothing for me as far as healing. I did that along time ago. My Viet-Nam buddies warned me this could be a "double edge sword" and I should have listen.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 17:19:17 (MST)
OK, where's Kokomo, and what's Pop-a-Top? I gather one is a bar? I've been coming here about two months, now, and never have quite figured them out. I see GUYMAN is back; if someone can get me a GPS number for him, I have a couple of buddies in the intelligence community, and could maybe get on of those B-2s from Diego Garcia diverted eastward a bit... (grin)
Max Whittington
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 17:12:01 (MST)
hmm, lots of stuff being said.lets see, u post in here, comment about us,then say dont take personally.no back bone and cowardness, hmm.We run away like frightened ignorant children.You stand alone cause ur tough and if anyone doesnt they soft and punks.You think the observer is funy when he bashes people for no reason,,kind people.you say let them go,who cares.you have made the ladies unwelcome here.they werent there and neither was mark, so mark shouldnt be here either? you have told me to watch my mouth.seems u do alot of telling to people espically when were all without backbones,moral courage,the ability to see ur point of view.Since when is compassion, love, caring,kindness, generousity and the milk of human kindness a fault and not a virtue? with out a doubt, u have earned u right to be here. So have all the others.If u truely believe all that crap u just spouted, then u are the worlds biggest fool.You havent learned a damn thing about being human.I used to be a biker. I am 6 foot, 220 pounds.i used to fight in bars,jail,didnt matter.I have been in 2 knife fights,and one gun fight.I cut a mans throat in 4 places ..justisfied, after he pulled a gun on my best friend and tried to shoot him, then attacked me with a bayonette.I have walked away from that kind of crap.Now fred, u are trying to do the same with a verbal knife.U try to kill peoples characters.U stand alone only cause u choose to.I find that the hugs and smiles of my BROTHERS in here to be of great personal warmth. excuse me.. and sisters.dont you dare tell people in here that they are spineless.Just who in the hell do u think u are to tell brothers to get out, or sisters.as many have said,this is a place of comfort,healing. reunions,and just a place to shoot the breeze between brohters. u dont want to be one, fine, but dont shove others out.You have a place here,and are welcome to it, but others do to ..without the need to be insulted, bashed or rediculed.if anyone hasnt told you..that sucks.perhaps u need to attend a reunion to feel the friendship and brotherhood. It didnt happen to me in louisville, but it sure did later in kokomo.fred, there is no need to stand alone in here as this isnt a place for that.we come in here to be together. Gently, welcome back.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 16:11:31 (MST)
Sure your right Gently.....I`m all that and more.....make sure you know your sources now.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 15:52:15 (MST)
well said ray. hope things going well for u buddy.We support you , all of us, do ray.No one wishes u but the best
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 15:28:08 (MST)
STREET, MD USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 15:04:53 (MST)
Our not posting is not about lack of self-esteem or confidence or any other sequence of words you want to put together thinking you are making us feel small. We came to this site to meet others with a common bond, to heal, to share, to make new friends, and re-visit old friends. It was a place of fun, sharing, family, and support. Some of you have changed that. You have used it to grandstand about yourself and stick your opinion down the throat of anyone who voiced an opinion that wasn't the same as yours. It's very boring! Write your opinions to the editor of your local newspaper. We want our site to be what is was, not what you have selfishly made it. Presently,I find it to be an boring, angry place, an unwelcoming place...but that has to stop. If letters to the editor don't satisfy your need to boast and rag, then go to a site that welcomes your boring, selfish, angry, self-rightous one-sidedness. This site is not for trashing our friends, nor trying to prove that everything you say is the way it is. Nor is it a place to cause anger. Additionally, Fred Skaggs, it was not your place to post my email to you on the web, but that shows how insecure you are. I sent that to you off the web to settle some things because I didn't/don't feel the web is the place for heated arguements. Apparently others don't either. I was tempted to post your unbelievably angry response to me, but I am not that insecure and didn't need to see how many friends I have out there, which is what I read as your reason. Now people, several of you have voiced our need to get back to what we were, and I'm going to do my part. We cannot let the "mouths" get in the way of the healing and friendship this site brought us. Please continue to post and ignore their postings. It is the way back. As Mark always says, "I wasn't there but I still care." And I do also. You know that. It breaks my heart to see whats been going on here. We're adults not spoiled insecure children. It's a place of peace and if you can't get into that, well, we'll just ignore you. So, post if you want to, but we're not going to read your posts. We're not going to read them-we're not going to read them. Back to normal flight--back to normal. With a smile on my face and a skip in my step-Gently
Gently <jsinger@uwm.edu>
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 14:53:50 (MST)
Gale....Good lord I think you know that none of that was directed at you. You yourself get kick out of my crazy ways, I know you do....This morning you made me feel like a kid...Kim and Freddie get in the corner and take a time out, you guys are kickin Boy George in the ass to much. Ted`s taken his ball and went home unhappy. Sure I`m a nice guy, nicest guy I know!!! And I know I make you laugh....don`t take shit so personal.....or I`ll debate you on that....e-mail me your phone number
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 14:47:24 (MST)
Freddie, what are we gonna do with you? I've talked to you before(even backed you on a few things) and you seem like a decent fella, but, I just don't know where you're comin' from. Now, I'm not even gonna attempt to debate you cause you would eat me up and spit me out. I'm not gonna debate anyone, but, that doesn't mean that I'm weak or without a backbone. If I was as intelligent and talented as you seem, I would be some place else trying to get the action that you want. This wasn't meant to be a debate forum for cryin' out loud. We are all over 50 and if we haven't learned how to handle ourselves yet.....come on, you sound like your preaching to bunch of kids here. If that's the way you are....fine, so be it,but, please don't catagorize the rest of us. You are welcome on here the same as the rest of us and we don't want to lose anyone. Every one of us have a different life and everyone doesn't debate things. The fact that you enjoy it doesn't make you any wiser than the rest of us and having a backbone is not quite as important to me as having compassion for people, including the brothers & sisters on this site. Freddie, I thought that we left the enemy in Nam.....at least I did. Remember that no one in here wants to be your enemy. Clear, Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 14:18:48 (MST)
Fellas, I noticed all the commo going on since Ted made his statement. That is great what he has to say, that`s what he feels in his heart. Ted will be back, believe me, he will be back. This is a addiction, it just takes a different form, that`s all. But no matter where I`ve been in the world, and I`ve been some places, I`ve been able to stand alone. No matter where I was, if the Germans had something to say to me and I didn`t like it, I let them know it. Same with the Spanish or Dutch or Italians or the French it didn`t matter I say what I feel. And I stood alone most the time. I`m not gonna be a punk or some candy ass that compromises. People will walk all over you if person makes compromises. You got to have a backbone in this world. I learn that at a early age. When I first got on this web-site I came on strong and found out very quickly that I stand alone here. Now there was a couple of people that came and stood beside me. There are guys on the web-site that I was with in Nam, that took a stance of," Man...Fred can`t say that". But I still liked them, because I knew where they were coming from. Things don`t change that much, really it don`t. People are pretty much the same as they were 30 some years ago, just more set in their ways. But I`ve always been smart enough to figure out that there is something in every guys personality that you can "lock into" and get conversation of something in common besides Viet-Nam. Now some of the ladies and gentlemen run that back channel and say they don`t feel welcome on the web-site, now because someone challeged a opinion or a statement they made. That`s a self-esteem problem or self-confidence thing or some sort of weakness. Don`t back away...re-enforce your opinion stand up for what you believe in. When I see a weakness in something like that I`m going for the kill emotionally. That`s just way I am. I`m not changing for anything or any reason. Now on the "flip side" of that I get e-mails and have phone conversations with guys I was with and new people who like my writing style and how I "stand and deliver". They also state that "It`s not the 129th I served in". They don`t want to sign in because maybe they are more thoughtful than me. That has happen before....But to "tiptoe around issues" and "weigh what I say" is not gonna happen. If you want to debate me on a issue because you don`t like what I say, lets go no problem. But remember I`ll be direct and say what I feel. I hate a loser and I`m not going to be one. You all probably look a this see alot of anger, it has nothing to do with anger,if you were sitting beside me you would see I`m quite calm. It`s just the way I articulate in order to get my point across. And I`m not leavin to go nowhere, as far as the web-site is concerned. But I am not a follower and I don`t live in the past, that`s history. I fought the same war you guys did and I have different opinion of it. I just moved on and did something with my life. Mr.Observer what can you say, I think he`s funny.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 13:40:04 (MST)
Has anyone heard from Ron Paye, Barry Winkler, Joe Johnson, Glen Pearmain, Rainer Bauer, Darwin Schmeidt,Ron Debates,Ted Gustafson,Dan Hertlein, Jim Hydinger.........how 'bout guys, you'all still out there. Check in once in a while !? Gale
Gale <beardatpaige1@cs.com>
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 13:07:13 (MST)
chuckling at max's joke. Now thats a great comeback.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 12:10:26 (MST)
Max Whittington
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 11:53:58 (MST)
ALVIS: My late father was with the 1st Marines Division at Guadalcanal, New Britain, New Georgia, etc. My mother was in the Women Marines during WWII, and is active (at age 79) in the Women Marines Association. Neither ever said one diparaging thing about my service in Vietnam, nor have any of their WWII veteran friends. In fact, my dad was eager for me to visit him in Alabama, so "I can show you off..." to his VFW club members. By the way, when Marines chide me about having two Marines as parents and *only* joining the Army, I tell them "Sorry, but I didn't qualify for the Marines — my parents were married."
Max Whittington
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 11:52:43 (MST)
good to see u posting gale, and u to jim.Thanks for the info. Sighs, yes jim , i remember that staemand cream. I spent many a happy 10 or 20 there, and i dont mean minutes.I remember going there once,every one was somehow intocecated,and we made bets on would get the ugliest woman there.and we tried to win. whew, thinks i had to get shots for 3 days after that episode.Mine was so ugly, u had to hide ur watch, or it would run backwards.It may have been frankinstiens ugly sister now that i think about it. whoo hoo, bon song bombers.15 cent beers,25 cent hard drinks, whata place. gale, my friend goes to the american consulate in sydney australia march 10th.We hope her visa will be approved then.Its been a very expensive and long process.Seems immergration has been flooded lately, and 911 has really slowed things down.( even at my own personal cost, i approve and thinks its been to long in coming) hopefuly she will be here for kokomo. We have already discussed she being there.I think she would have had a ball. Atlanta?, who knows,its still possiable i wont make it.Time needs to get closer b4 that decesion can be made.If I understand correctly, Australia vets also didnt get the welcome home their fathers did. speaking of that, any of u get told by ww2 vets that "our" war wasnt crap and that we were just a bunch of cry babies. I havent heard that for a few years.It seemed to me, that it isolated us even more.perhaps it was just jealousy at their passing of the tourch. never understood that one.My father, who is/was a vet of ww2 ans korea,was very ,very proud. My uncle,a vet of korea and vietnam, took the cry babies statement to heart.Maybe it was because he was a cornel( forgive my spelling) in a engineer outfit,r.e.m.f. who saw fighting only at the offericers club, if there. ahh, i degress, sorry .I guess what i am trying to say is that familes were even divided by that war.Seems the only other time that happened was the civil war.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 11:31:16 (MST)
RICK: In the same vein as your "prayer": I was once asked what I would write in a "personals ad." I came up with: "Tall thin manic depressive seeks oversexed female pharmacist." Today I'd look for a lady veterinarian who likes to fish.
Max Whittington
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 11:29:05 (MST)
TINNITIS: Soon after returning from Vietnam, I had some trouble with my hearing. I was told at the base hospital that the main cause for helicopter crew members getting tinnitis was sitting alongside the transmission for long periods of time. Gunners and crew chiefs tended to be more prone to it than pilots, for obvious reasons. They thought I had it, but it turned out that I had developed large plugs of wax in my ears, which may have saved my hearing. WAR STUFF: My opinion was best expressed by Sir Galahad: "Might for right." 'Nuff said. WEATHER (PORTLAND, OR): I was over at my parent's place yesterday; daffodils were blooming; new lawn is up and my stepfather just mowed it! Mildest winter I can remember.
Max Whittington
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 11:10:20 (MST)
Alvis, yeh I've got it in both ears. Sounds like the screeching that you get when you're getting on the internet.....or maybe the screeching of my two ex-wives. Pretty simliar. Speaking of that Alvis, how's things with "Australia". Anything goin' on buddy? Maybe we can meet her at Kokomo !? ;o) Gale
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 10:41:36 (MST)
It warmed up a little here( but not enough for body-surfing) (more jealousy) , Thanks Alex, for what you have written. Personally, I think That if you havn't got the testes to sign what is written, it doesn't belong here. I hate to think of anyone leaving this site because of some of those things, If you do that, it protects you from what is there but deprives us of you. I have been posting a little less, but I am not gone, I read every day. I realize I have no business in this political stuff on this site & so will stay away from that subject & some other things. Suffice it to say that, i still get that sense of belonging here. There is something as my friend Fred Alvis has said that trancends all this that passes between us (can't explain it, just know it's there). The Purpose of this site, i believe, is to be a place of healing. " Tinnitus" is a constant ringing in your ears that doesn't go away. To get it in the ville, you refuse to pay that little cutie & she bangs you real hard in the side of the head with a frying pan ( almost happened to me). does anyone/or everyone remember that little steam bath place in the ville? Really used to like it there. Be kind to each other--- that's something few of us have had enough of--- because a lot of us were treated like dirt when we came back, the way through that is not to do it to one another now. As Paul McCartney said " And in the end, The LOVE you Take--- is equal to the LOVE you MAKE. Love & respect, Smitty
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, Wy. USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 10:40:52 (MST)
that ear thing bothers me sometimes also.I never really knew what might be the cause of it. Anyone remember spraying solvent into a running lycoming turbine engine as it was run up to full throttle? Kneeling on the engine deck,head close to engine, and way to close to whirling rotor blades? I remember it being so loud, i acutualy coundt think.It was overwhelming.I sometimes wonder if that ear thing came form that source.its not constant,or even daily, but when it comes,its very loud.Kinda like a telephone.Is that what u guys mean?
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 10:24:10 (MST)
Gale it must have been the clapping I just got carried away. HEHEHE*****check this out***** A GIRLS PRAYER Lord, Before I lay me down to sleep, I pray for a man, who's not a creep, One who's handsome, smart and strong, One who's loves to listen long, One who thinks before he speaks, When he says he'll call, he won't wait weeks. I pray that he is gainfully employed, And when I spend his cash, he won't be annoyed. Pulls out my chair and opens my door, Massages my back and begs to do more. Oh! send me a man who'll make love to my mind, Knows what to answer to "How big's my behind?" One who'll make love till my body's a'twitchin, In the hall, in the garden and in the kitchen! I pray that this man will love me to no end, And never attempt to hit on my friend. A GUY'S PRAYER: Lord, I pray for a nympho with huge boobs who owns a liquor store and likes to fish. Amen
Rick England
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 10:10:38 (MST)
Alex, very well put. Rick, I think that you better look up the definition of tinnitus ole buddy if you think you "contacted" it in the vill. ;o] Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 10:03:55 (MST)
Flight: This is not a political site. The is a site where we come to visit with brothers, family of and friends of the 129t AHC. The site is here for everyone to enjoy. We fought our War!! but, this isn't the place to fight another. Let's get back to what this site was designed for members, family, friends of the 129thAHC. And to the OBSERVER!!! I think you need to write President Bush and his people!! They make care what you have to say!! But, this group of real men don't!! Even though we have our own thoughts on the world events, I don't think this is the place to air them. We have each others email for that. Thanks My Brother Alex This is not to offend anyone . Just some advice,so we have our site for all to enjoy. And not feel that they have to leave.
Alex <afernwal@midsouth.rr.com>
Memphis, Tn USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 09:45:46 (MST)
Gale I didn't know the blades had anything to do with it. I always thought it was sneaking out to the vill. or stoping at the car wash. HEHEHEHE
Rick England
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 09:42:17 (MST)
Good work Rick. I've had tinnitus for a couple of years now. I'm sure that the clapping of the blades had something to do with it. One of my problems was cracking my skull against the rotor heads all the time, as I'm sure others did. I'm thankful though that I don't have any hearing loss yet. Great joke Rick. LOL Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 09:06:47 (MST)
I will keep you up to date if I hear more.******* 3. COURT DECIDES TINNITUS COMPENSATION ELIGIBILITY The United States Court of Appeals for Veterans Claims has announced a decision in the case of Wanner v. Principi. At issue was whether service connection or compensation for tinnitus should be allowed only for "head injury, concussion or acoustic trauma." The Court held that persistent tinnitus, no matter how it was acquired during service, entitles a veteran to compensation under the rating schedule. Accordingly, in claims for service connection for tinnitus filed before June 10, 1999, including those now on appeal, claimants will now be entitled to service connection without regard to how the tinnitus was acquired. The court did not decide whether veterans are entitled to separate ratings for service-connected bilateral tinnitus (tinnitus in each ear).
Rick England
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 08:56:24 (MST)
This a good one with a laugh. The Astute Donkey********** Please read all of this!************* One day a farmer's donkey fell into an abandoned well. The animal cried piteously for hours as the farmer tried to figure out what to do. Finally, he decided the animal was old and the well needed to be covered up anyway; so it just wasn't worth it to him to try to retrieve the donkey. He invited all his neighbors to come over and help him. They each grabbed a shovel and began to shovel dirt into the well. Realizing what was happening, the donkey at first cried and wailed horribly. Then, a few shovelfuls later, he quieted down completely. The farmer peered down into the well, and was astounded by what he saw. With every shovelful of dirt that hit his back, the donkey was doing something amazing. He would shake it off and take a step up on the new layer of dirt. As the farmer's neighbors continued to shovel dirt on top of the animal, he would shake it off and take a step up. Pretty soon, the donkey stepped up over the edge of the well and trotted off, to the shock and astonishment of all the neighbors!*************** Life is going to shovel dirt on you, all kinds of dirt. The trick to getting out of the well is to not let it bury you, but to shake it off and take a step up. Each of our troubles is a steppingstone. We can get out of the deepest wells just by not stopping, never giving up! Shake it off and take a step up! Remember the five simple rules to be happy:******** Free your heart from hatred.******* Free your mind from worries.******* Live simply.*********** Give more.******** Expect less.********* Also, the donkey kicked the shit out of the guy that tried to bury him. Which brings me to another moral for this story: When you try to cover your ass, it always comes back and gets you.************Flight be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 08:44:50 (MST)
Observer, advance and be recognized or keep your opinions out of here. This has all gotten out of hand and I agree with Alvis....we don't need you adding fuel to the fire. If you are a brother of the 129th let us know, otherwise, go spread your crap somewhere else. You won't break us up for we have a far deeper agenda you do! Sorry Ted, Kim, Freddie and others.....what say we chill Brothers! Clear, Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 08:30:29 (MST)
thank you rick. I do hope to truely see u again. Its a warm memory of you, ted, gale,mark,ted, ron,gently,elizabeth,and wives, hubbies, all at the reunion.Hopes more come to the next one,as i think it made us closer,reconeted, whatever.Cool breezes to you my friend, sitting there in that warm sun.enjoy, more snow here today and more this weekend.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 08:27:03 (MST)
why dont u get over it observer.No one comes here to get bashed or made a fool of.if u must target some one, then aim at me. Your comments to ted, offend me, your out of there, indeed. A hammer has 2 uses, to build thigs, or to tear things apart.lets build.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 08:19:46 (MST)
Thats a good metaphor FRED A. Remember,a helicopter has to have weight on both sides to fly evenly. Lets not crash folks. We can't lose our CG.
Rick England
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 08:18:30 (MST)
as far as iraq goes, I feel like I want to stick Saddam in the eye with a stick.I just dont want to look like a bully.People forget He did caused terrible things in Kuwait.Taking child life support nachines right out from under babies, burning wells,stealing anything of value.He has gassed the kurds,killing thousands.He brings grandchildren into jails, gouges out their eyeball in front of grandparents toget confessions.We know the bozo of bagdag has ties to ben L.Anyone ever have anything stolen, you know who did it,but, cant prove it? Kinda how i feel about this. now, something more dear to my heart. I have gotten e mails from a few brothers that arent happy here anymore,or dont feel comfy anymore.The sisters dont feel welcome .I, for one,hopes they all come back and post.I shared a lot of damn good fellowship with folks up in Kokomo, it opened something in me.This site was responseable for the first crack in that door.I think Ray granger has gotten lots of support out of here. We all came together.(Ray, I hope that doesnt offend you).I for one , am trying now to keep my post light,unofenseive and positive. We do all have a right to our opinions.Perhaps we just shouldnt shout them tho. Hmm,lots of rough edges around here now,havent seen a sister post in ages.Remember,a helicopter has to have weight on both sides to fly evenly. Lets not crash folks.
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 08:11:41 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
STREET, MD USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 06:56:24 (MST)
Status of Reservatuins for flight from Valdosta Ga. to PSp Ca, March 10th 2003 What time do I need to be at airport
Joseph E. Cox <joecox195earthlink.net>
Quitman, Ga USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 04:43:20 (MST)
I concede, It seems the "Bush bashers" have succeeded in taking over the commo here, so I'm outa here. Heard enough of this shit during Viet Nam. If Saddam and his Islamic cohorts plant a suitcase nuke in this country, dust your ass with anthrax, or poison your water supply with some other chemical or biological agent,you will be the first to whine about the administration "Not doing anything to protect you". Mark, thanks for trying to make a page where we could all come together as veterans with a common background, the 129th. For some of the rest of you, "You lost the election, GET OVER IT" BYE
Ted Buisker
Davis, IL. USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 04:29:39 (MST)
Fred Alvis....You`re awfully mellow this days....LOL.....Bright lights and sunshine must be in the mix.....it`s a good thing my friend.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 27, 2003 at 03:50:20 (MST)
laughing at kims post, and agreeing with second half. some good points there.
USA - Wednesday, February 26, 2003 at 23:29:18 (MST)
Two elderly gentlemen from a retirement center were sitting on a bench under a tree when one turns to the other and says, "Sam, I'm 83 years old now and I'm just full of aches and pains. I know you're about my age. How do you feel?" Sam says, "Well, I feel just like a new-born baby." "Really!? Like a baby!?" "Yep. No hair, no teeth, and I think I just wet myself."
USA - Wednesday, February 26, 2003 at 21:44:51 (MST)
Body surfing in February...no big deal, we do it in Maine, all winter! Just get going out of control, on the ski slope! Skis go one way, poles go another,goggles, hat, gloves, all disappear, slide on your stomach for a few hundred yards, climb back after your gear, listen to everyone on the lift laughing at you....and go do it again! what as the lament on the shithouse wall??/ We the unwilling, are here to do the unnecessary, for the ungrateful, at the request of the uncaring????? I feel a little hypocritical, how do I support the soldiers, when I don't support their cause??? As more information comes out, I hope I'll hear the proof that it WAS necessary to go after the Iraqi regeim. There's a saying...to know what's right, and not act accordingly, is to want for courage...Kang Foo Ju...Confucius...we've all been there, at one time or another....shithead is talking right now...it's my fervent hope that he and his cronies let Colin Powell run the show..Light casualties, a quick fight, and get to hell out of there, as quietly as possible
USA - Wednesday, February 26, 2003 at 17:34:00 (MST)
I agree with you animal. I do want to support the troops that are there and are ready to leave. I have some addresses of about 4 or 5 over there now an will be sending some goodie boxes. If anybody intrested bc me an I will give you those addys.
Rick England
USA - Wednesday, February 26, 2003 at 07:33:56 (MST)
Animal(Greg)......well spoken my friend and like you I support our soldiers, but I can`t seem to find it in my heart to support Bush and his Croonies....And nobody is going to jail for Enron and the likes. BODY SURFING in February......Man I envy you.....Livin the life.....you deserve it my friend
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 23:11:47 (MST)
Fred Alvis....I love that sound track of "Crossroads". Steve Vai did all the guitar work. My favorite song is "They Call Me Willie" . Fred.....I relate to being paraded around and everyone wanted a piece of you. Kinda like "The New Kid In Town" and in reality.....you were a new kid and alot different than when you left. I remember my "buddies" takin me to the "frat house" on campus. They wanted to be the first ones to have a "token" Nam Vet.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 23:01:52 (MST)
Aloha, As this war approaches, we're going to be hearing a lot more from the people protesting it. I feel strongly against it myself, as I felt strongly against the Vietnam war. Alhough I was against the war, I did my best to support my fellow soldiers while in country and had no doubts about my personal role until I came home. It took me a long time to get over it, but I finally have. It wasn't the soldiers who fought the war that made it wrong, but the people who profited by it. In spite of what I've just stated, I don't feel that Larry or the thousands of others that gave their lives, died in vain. I have a great love for this imperfect country we live in, and it takes many different points of view to make a free society. So while I feel obligated to speak against this upcoming war, I will always speak highly of the soldiers fighting to keep ME free to speak my mind. The government has already started limiting our personal freedoms. Pretty soon they are going to start taking money from education, health care, the arts, and who knows what else, to finance the war. Now, what I'm wondering is who's going to profit the most from these diverted funds? Our brave troops, or our bloated weapons industry? My personal solution to our dilemma(simplified)is to develop alternative fuels:Hydrogen,solar,Bio,geothermal etc. The technology is here. Let the middle east wallow in their own mess. Let the Arabs send US their cash for our levis and technology, instead of us making them powerfull because we're addicted to their oil. The reason this isn't likely to happen, is our current leaders are ALL in the oil or weapons industry. I think the point I was trying to make when I started this is not to think of war protesters as being unpatriotic or chickenshits. This country was founded on dissent. Well thanks my brothers for letting me say that, and yes, I did go bodysurfing today. With respect, Greg
Puna , HI USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 23:01:50 (MST)
personally, i think of the 129th as brothers.we shared what few otheres did.There is a bond that links most of us. lsd, cocaine,mushrooms,catus,speed,herion, and more.I didnt want to think about what i had been thru.Was back 3 days and started putting a neddle in my arm.took me a good 10 years to get thru it,lay the drugs down and walk away.been to aa,na metting in the past.Even went 5 years once, clean, dry and sober.did the drugs mess my mind up?or was it vietnam?We each had our own journey there,a slightly diferent path. I didnt go for college,i went cause my country called. War was pretty heady stuff for me back then, did i have what it takes and so on.I smile at my lost innocence.I am thankfull for my " band of brothers" here.Some of the poisin can be let go, most understand.I dont think of all nam vets as brothers,but i feel the 129th are.I know that if i needed help,someone out there would try, if even nothing more than moral suport.I know its there and from people that shared exactly what i did.There is a bond between smitty and i that transends the concept of brother.Hell, my real brother paraded me around like a dangerous pet.he and some other friends, fed off what i/ we had been thru.When i first got back, i couldnt hang with friends that were still innocent, something had passed.i wasnt comfortable anymore.I got so damn tried of that same question..did u kill anyone? and its still ask today.jesus christ.wonders where the sisters post are at? do they not feel welcome anymore? personally, i think they round off some of some very rough edges, course that just might be me. hey fred scaggs, u ever hear the sound track to the movie cross roads? its from about earlt 80s or so.Love the blues music in it, one of my favorites.its "delta" blues and not a bad movie either. hey gale and smitty...chuckle, i took pics of those daffodills,so i know i wasnt brain dead at the time.chuckle.Observer, dang that was some long winded stuff.had shorter ca's than that. and to those i met at kokomo, i dang sure consider u friends as well as brothers.As i said b4, we might bicker and argue, but woe be the one that trys to come between any of the 129th.I think its kinda like a family here.shrug, but then, i am also a hopless romantic. we find blue skies wherever we can i suppose. Mark, ty for making this site possible
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 21:53:56 (MST)
FRED SKAGGS,That would be 26 BILLION...with a "B"....AND we sold out the Kurds in the North to the Turks as part of the deal. Remember the Kurds after the 1st Gulf War? Daddy Bush told the people of Iraq to rise up to overthrow Saddam. Well the Kurds in the North and the Shites in the south did just that. They rebeled...we gave them ZERO support...Huusein crushed them....then we established the NO FLY ZONES. Since then the Kurds have lived autonomously for about twelve years...established their own system of government, education and so on. Dubya Bush just sold the Kurds out to the Turks with the recent deal by agreeing that the Turks may send their own troops into Northern Iraq, not to fight Saddam, but to crush the Kurds again, keeping them from establishing their own independent Kurdistan. You see, there are Kurds living in the bordering areas of Turkey and the Turks don't want the Kurds to get carried away with this "Democracy Bullshit"....Does anyone really wonder why folks across the globe resent the foreign policy of the US? Seems the US has done this kind of thing many times before...encourage well meaning folks of the world to take up arms against an oppressor (And US enemy)then dump them when their usefulness to Uncle Sam is exhausted. Can anyone say "Montongard" (forgive the spelling please). One step further back in Vietnam's history...The US encouraged and supported the Vietnamese to rise up against the Japanese invaders during WWII. They did. Mission accomplished by a group of Nationalistic freedom fighters called the "Vietmihn"...led by none other than Ho Chi Mihn! Immediately after the conclusion of WWII, Uncle Sam gave the green light to France to retake it's pre-WWII colony. When the Vietmihn and Ho said "NO..we liberated Vietnam from the Japanese for the Vietnamese, Not for the French!"....and the war was on. After Ho and company kicked France's ass out, the US picked up where France left off.......So once again we are setting up a situation where we buddy up to a nation or culture, take what we want and then sell them out. Not too hard to figure out why the international consensus is that Uncle Sam can't be trusted. .......Don't misunderstand where I'm coming from here....I strongly support what our country stands for, I'm not very sure how much is left of what we stand for. MY COUNTRY, RIGHT OR WRONG. BE IT RIGHT, KEEP IT RIGHT. BE IT WRONG, MAKE IT RIGHT!
Fred Brown <FJBuffalo@Yahoo.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 21:27:14 (MST)
Fred S. OK. I understand better where you are comming from. I did not mean to imply that all Army or Vietnam Vets deserve to be called Brother, but I don't think any person on the 129th web-site has tried to kill me, lie to me, cheat me or violate my trust. Anyway enough said. Take care. I"M CLEAR!!! Frank.
Frank Loveday <bluecobra@dav.net.>
Bastrop, La. USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 20:42:26 (MST)
Damn....26 billion... you all knew what I meaning....just got me upset.....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 20:37:11 (MST)
Thank You Jeff........Animal..I guess Mr. Observer is getting a little "long winded", but they appear to be articles and interviews with points well made. The winds of war are getting closer, so he`s making a point. The anti-war sentiment is growing......26 million to Turkey and our economy is going down the tubes. 26 million could sure support a "national health care program". Half that would sure prop up our VA health system. Food for thought....Only took the Bush Admin. 20 days from 9/11 to write the 400 page Homeland Security Document that circumvents our civil rights......nothing moves that fast in Washington. That shit was being written before 9/11...... and nobody even knows completely what it says......isn`t this the government for the people and by the people.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 19:52:40 (MST)
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 19:09:49 (MST)
Mr.(?) Observer, I'm sure you have some interesting ideas, but if you want me to read them, you should shorten them up a bit. Greg
HI USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 18:57:19 (MST)
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 18:38:43 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
- Observer Post Removed -
Frank L......... Brother-1) A male having 1 or both parents in common with another individual. 2) A fellow man or a male friend. 3) A lay member of a men`s religious order. Brotherhood-1) The state or quality of being brothers. 2) An association, as a fraternity, united for a common purpose. 3) The whole body of persons in a profession or trade........ Frank, that`s all good what you say....But I just related a experience in life, that would give you and everybody else a little insight what motivates me sometimes. That doesn`t mean that I have a "bad attitude". I have plenty of Vet-Nam veteran friends, but Nam was never our total common thread, we truly liked and cared for each other. To say we never talked about Nam would be a lie, but it was never our topic of conversation. I never stopped and helped a "homeless vet" because "he`s my brother". I did it because that`s what you`re suppose to do as a good human being on this earth. I never respected NCO`s or Officer`s when I was in the Army because that`s what they were. I respected the for the person they were and the leadership quality that they displayed in a given situation. Not all our NCO`s and Officer`s were "Born Leaders". As bad as I hate to admit it, but "stereotypes" tend to be exactly how you see it. The army and Viet-Nam was just a means in which to get to where I wanted to be in life. There is a price that a person pays in order to get what they want in life. Viet-Nam service was just the price I paid to get a free college education. That`s all it was. I always viewed Nam as the "worse job" I ever had. And I did it to best of my ability and college was my payment.....maybe a new car also. But the people I mention in my story, they were not my brothers. They lied, they stole, they cheated and violated people`s trust. That`s not a brother....that`s not a friend. Another little issue here....The people that "fragged" the 129th company area back then, were they our brothers? They tried to kill us, but they are our brothers. There is "good friends" on the web-site, that I knew 33 years ago, and they are still good friends that I would do anything within my power to help them if needed, but brothers. One person on this web-site would even know who I am if they were to see me, Mark Jackson, that`s it. Maybe that`s why I give him so much shit....he met me...And I guess you could say I`m his friend. So Frank that`s just me, and I`m not gonna change. I hope we have a good understanding, because there isn`t anything in this world better than a good understanding.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 13:10:04 (MST)
Fred S. As i'm sure you know, there are many definitions to the word Brother. a few of them are: a class of individuals of the same kind, profession or occupation. An association of men united for the same purpose, and many more i'm sure, anyway all my Brothers & Sisters of the 129th be carefull, take care. I'M CLEAR!!! Frank.
Frank Loveday <bluecobra@dav.net.>
Bastrop, La USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 10:38:13 (MST)
Animal, I agree...you are very talented. Also, thanks for looking up Nazarro. There's one listed in Alaska...maybe I'll check it out. Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 09:57:23 (MST)
Animal(Greg), you are extremely talented. My wife and I love Tiffany lamps, but to get a original would cost a "arm and leg". We`ve bought original native american art in Santa Fe. And we bought orignal oil`s from Spain and Italy when we were in europe. Get that "bug" out of your computer, so I can "RAP" to you about some of your lamps and work you`ve done.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 08:25:31 (MST)
Animal(Greg) so you`re a artist, that`s great. Fred Brown is a artist also, seems the creative types are more open to change and new things....like music. I get along great creative types and my "blue collar" union buddies. I like Kid Rock he puts out some great stuff....I like Fred Durst of Limp Bizkit. Yea I got alot of music in my collection and I spend alot of money too. But that`s my hobbie, stereo eguipment and music. Plus when living in Europe, my wife and I "hung out" with Twenty and Thirty something`s. Young folks over there are alot more mature than american young adults. But the young men I hung out with, had all served in Bosnia and Croatia. They still have a draft in Holland. But they were always puzzled by the treatment Viet-Nam war vets recived upon their return from war. But I explained that those same people who spit on us, went on to become what we call "yuppies" and create the excesses of the 80`s and things called "junk bonds" that almost distroyed the US economy in the Reagan era. Yea....Marky Mark....you made references to the 60`s and 70`s "about we all did things", you obviously didn`t read what I wrote a few weeks back, I didn`t do LSD, or any synthetic man made drug in my life. NEVER...I`ve been a straight up pot-head...that`s all. I drink beer in Europe because "that`s REAL beer". It`s not this watered down stuff here in the states. Remember...at the Pop-A-Top all Kim and I was drinking was 7-UP and Coke. Like Steppenwolf`s song " Pusher Man" (I`ve never done nothing that my spirit couldn`t kill) I may have had the "Spirit of the 60`s and 70`s" , but I never did psychedelic drugs or cocaine or heroine. That shit would mess your mind up.....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 08:04:14 (MST)
Animal, nice work on the etched face! You guys need to check out the link!
Dave Powers <powers@montrose.net>
Montrose, Colorado USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 08:03:00 (MST)
Update on the Iron Butterfly from Tropical Helicopter. Not to bad, sunny some days rainy the next. Training going well. We have to students to do check rides this week, so real busy. Our girl should be in the state of Florida in a month or so. The weather where she is is bad. Should have all of the final paper work done this week. Thanks for keeping in touch with me and the project, it is very important to me to keep all of you guys involved. Speak to you soon, Monte
Rick England
USA - Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 07:03:34 (MST)
www.stainedglassbiz.com the web address didn't print for some reason
USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 23:02:23 (MST)
Well I gotta say there is some good Rap Music out there. What about Bob Dylon's great rap song?...(.........the pump don't work, cause the vandels took the handles.......)I also like Kid Rock, another Detroit boy who mixes Rap with rock and even country. As we get older we tend to start sounding like the old people before us. They talked bad about elvis and the stones and whatever the young generation was into at the time. ( Oh no... we're becoming our parents!) I've always liked the new sounds once you get passed the mainstream stuff. (boy bands, Disco)Anyway, Fred S. , I bet your CD collection is worth spending some time with. Anyyway,... John, you mentioned Stoney, As a matter of fact we were pretty good friends, but have drifted apart over the years. We derosed at the same time and were both in the DC area, so we jumped in a Van and did a crazy road trip to Fla together. Visited "Rebel" from the 129th and some other friends from flight school. I saw him again about '77 in LA but haven't heard from him since. Would you send me his email address? I kind of grew up all over and never lived in the same place for more than a couple of years. That is until I moved to the Big Island and started a family 16 years ago. I've lived in Denver, Milwaukee, Charlotte, Boone NC, Maryland, Tallahassee, New Orleans, LA, Catalina Island, and now this island. I'm a graphic artist and manufacturer of sandblasted deco tiles.( Small time) I got started in graphic arts renovating old houses and soon realised the art was more fun than the renovating. If any of you are interested in seeing my work, there's an example on the web at http://www.stainedglassbiz.com/ Go to the gallery and it's on the second or third page. Enough for now, By the way I looked up Nazzaro in the phone book to no avail. I think I remember him posting awhile back though, so maybe he's still around. Stay warm.....Greg
Puna, HI USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 22:57:55 (MST)
Few things here: Mark...background of Rap....It`s always been said, Isaac Hayes was the grandfather of rap, he was a academy award winner writer. Soundtrack to "Shaft", Isaac also wrote "Soulman" for Sam and Dave. But Isaac would do a "monologue" before every song he did, it was called Ike`s Rap, Gil Scott-Heron " The Revolution Will Not Be Televised" 1974, straight up "rap", Oscar Brown Jr, "Ladiesman" 1972. But Rap has a long history, James Brown sure didn`t sang.LOL 40 years from now there might be the Eminen Breakfast Club.... Bob Seger wrote "war protest songs" think "Two Plus Two Is On My Mind" that was about refusing the draft and not going to Viet-Nam. Listen to words.....I use to go see Bob Seger at Valley Dale Dancehall in Columbus, Ohio, for .50 cover charge. Sir Timothy and The Royals would open up for him....they went on to become the Ohio Express" Yummy, Yummy". Seger band was called "The Last Herd and then he changed to The Bob Seger System. Jeff Sauers...North Witcher and I were talking about you yesterday, were your ears burning? He remembered when you got transfered to the 1st platoon.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 19:12:10 (MST)
Flight...I been wanting to put this true story on the web site for a while; Back in 1979, every morning on the way to work, I would stop at a coffee shop in Columbus,Ohio to get my morning coffee. It was called Capital City Dounut Shop, I`d been going there since 1975. Well one morning I went in to get my coffee and there was a new face behind counter. Now I had kept some of my old army shirts, you know wear on a cool fall morning. But that morning I had wore one with a 1st Aviation patch and my flight wings. The young man behind the counter took my order and while giving back my change, he ask me if I was in Viet-Nam? Being proud young vet I said," Yea man". The young man look at me and said," So was I". I said,"Who were you with"? He said he was the Chaplain for the 173rd Airborne. Being a 129th guy I said, "Where were you at"? He said, "Saigon". Well I was in a hurry, so I said to myself "What the hell". But I thought to myself," That dude was really young to have been in Nam". But I let it go....next day...there`s the same young guy behind the counter. He said," Good Morning Brother". I`ve never been much of a morning person, so I said,"What`s up"?. He said," Man you belong to the VVA". I said,"No". He said," Well I`m the Chaplain for the VVA". He went on to say I should come to a meeting and join. I said," Sure thing". So I went on to work again. A couple of weeks passed and I saw him again one morning. He went thru the same routine, but this time I ask him," Does Bong Son rang a bell"? He replied,"No". Then I ask about, LZ English and LZ Uplift, he replied,"Nope, never heard of those places". Damn!!!!! I thought, where could this guy have been with the 173rd. So time went on and I nver saw the young man anymore. One morning I ask the people who ran the coffee shop," Where`s that young dude that was behind counter a few months ago"? They said," He`s the assistant minister at St.Luke church now". My thought was, " Well the guy is a minister, he wouldn`t lie". So time went on for a few months and a friend from work that was a Nam Vet ask me one day, Fred, you want to go to a VVA meeting with me"? I said," What the hell, I`ll go with you Saturday. So Saturday came and off to the meeting I went with my friend Ron Sherell. Went we got to the meeting, it was being held at Vets Memorial Convention Center. Man....there was over 5,000 Nam vets in attendance...I thought I`d died and gone to heaven. IT was great.....I saw these guys with bright orange satin jackets, with black scipt writing that said, Viet-Nam Vets Reminding America. It was their softball team, I had dreamed of playing softball with a all Nam Vet team. And I was a good softball player, I was playing for a traveling team sponsored by Kroger Stores and called The Kroger All-Stars, so I was very good. But we went on into the meeting and sitting on the stage was That young man from the coffee shop. Now he was sitting with the local President Eugene Watts, History Professor from Ohio State University, The Vice President James Alstadt, The treasurer Richard Alstadt, Jim and Dick were brothers... and the VVA Chaplain,Ed Cooper... it was impressive. But let me get to the point here, after the meeting I went up to the Chaplain Cooper and I said, You remember me"? He said,"Yea" I said to him, "You know, I was with the 129th AHC in Nam and I was just wordering when you were with the 173rd"? He replied," 69 and 70"....I said, " You never heard of LZ English or Uplift"? He said,"No" I thought ......RIGHT. So feeling very pissed off, I looked up Vice President Dick Alstadt and got his attention, I told him I was in Nam in 70 and worked with the 173rd at English and Uplift and Chaplain Cooper had no recall of those places. I told him that the 173rd was based there. Well Dick look at me and said," We been wondering about him, because some of the stuff he says don`t jive". So Dick got Gene Watts and his brother Jim attention and I told my story. They assured me that they were going to check it out. So I left with a "bad feeling" about all this. While leaving I approached one of the softball players and made it known that I wanted a shot at playing ...that it was a dream of mine. Well he told me in so many words....that this is a "clique" and you might as well forget it. One year later I would be playing for the Kroger All-Stars and we would meet the VVA team and beat them 29 to 3 in 5 inning`s, we "run ruled" them. It was a sweet victory....But on with my story...about three weeks later Eugene Watts announced his run for the Senate for the state of Ohio. Now here`s the good stuff....I was working out on the job-site by myself and saw two Lincoln Town Cars approaching me. When they got closer I realized it was Senator (to be) Gene Watts, Jim Alstadt, Dick Alstadt and Pastor Ed Cooper. They all got out and motion for me to come over to the cars. They wanted to talk to me....so as I approached them...they started talking Brother this and Brother that.... I just stopped and ask. "What`s Up". Well they let me know that Gene Watts was gonna be Senator and he was gonna "part the waters for Viet-Nam Vets". I said," What`s that got to do with me"? They said," Chaplain Cooper is worried that you could cause problems for our run..... I said,"Well the Mo----F---k-- don`t need to be tellin lies"..... They said, " Fred...you could discredit the whole thing". I said, " So Pastor Cooper wasn`t in Nam"....And they confirmed my suspicions. But they were willing to let things go because "it was our time brother". Well Gene Watts went on to serve in the senate for the state of Ohio for two terms, he nerver did shit for vets......Jim Alstadt went on to become the president of a private hospital(Mercy Hospital) in Columbus. He later served time because the hopital went broke and he was busted for embezzlement of funds.....Jim Alstadt went on to become a bank official and was later busted for a "credit card" scam and pulled time in jail. Pastor Cooper went on to be Head Minister at St. Lukes Methodist Church, he was counseling the women of the church, who were having "rocky marriages". Everything went fine until one of the women committed suicide...She admitted to having a affair in her suicide note with Pastor Ed...Her husband sued the church and Pastor Ed...Never heard from Pastor Ed again. But since that "lesson in life", I`ve learn that because somebody served in Nam or said they served....Was Not My Brother. That`s always influenced me when some Nam vet calls me brother. This all is a true story in a time frame of 1979 thru 1985. So when it all comes down to it...No one is your brother... good friends maybe. And that was a defining moment in my life as far as anything concerning Viet-Nam. Also I probably don`t trust certain things about reunions and other stuff. Maybe you guys will understand why I`m like I am. But this is a "honest to god" true story.
Fred Skaggs <ac459429@earthlink.net>
Raleigh, NC USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 18:24:58 (MST)
Mark, No I am saying they refused to get on the ac because they were not going to go into Cambodia. Was not an act of courage!
USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 18:24:51 (MST)
.......shucks....those two words showed up on the same line in my last post.....I knew I should of held on longer.....Hey Jeff S...........Good to see you here. Are you saying that the grunts you speak of at LZ Merideth refused to get on the ships because they were willing to stay and fight???...if so, WOW!!!!!......so many stories of so much courage. WOW!!!!......I thank all of you, for what you did for me, so long ago!!!!!take care brothers and sisters, Always a brother, Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 17:46:52 (MST)
...Fred...PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!..do not use the word rap..........................................................................................and music in the same line.........................emulate what emvironment????....... Bob Seger grew up in Detriot also....which would you defend first?......I agree that music comes from a background of culture.......but rap has no background to the best of my knowledge.................sorry Fred....have to disagree with on this one..............and as far as the Beatles.......yeah..to our parents, they were just maken a bunch of noise.......but now that noise is heard in just about every elavator that we ride in......and the words of Lennon and McCartney are things that I believe in "All You Need Is Love", and " You Never Felt The Rain My Friend, Till Ya Felt It Runnin' Down Your Back".......Radio stations have Beatles's weekends. Breakfast with the Beatles on Sunday morning's..........bet you'll never hear of an eminem weekened of music.:-)))).......Ozzie, Drugs, Bad guy????......not a role mode?l....come Fred. You grew up in the 60's and 70's..........I did stuff, bet you did too. I raised 3 wonderful daughters and am still married to the same wife of 30 years..and have alays been a workin' my ass off kinda a guy....drugs didnt alter me any. Yeah, I would take Ozzie as a role model before Two pac, or what ever his name is, was, spelled.....no, a wannbe ain't something diffrent? A wanna be is somebody, being somebody, he ain't.....eminem is, or could, be a very nice young man. I dont know..................but I bet he ain't acting like himself. That is a wannabe! Hey!!!!!!!!!!!....Guess what????...snowing in Ohio again. Dee had the day off from school. Saw a wheather man say today that we have had over 30" this winter.....not much for some...but latly round these parts, it tis!!!!!.....No time in sight when I will be able to get the Hog out.................Animal.....You didnt offend any one..this is an open forum.....speak you piece.....we all just have to remember to keep the peace!!!..hey Alex;-)))////whats the matter with gettin' to close to the Pop-A-Top.'-)))))) You been stuck there before;-))))).....Hey, by the way Alex......I want to thank you for the great job you have been doin as President of the VHCMA!!!!.....Hip,Hip Hooray for you!!!!!!!!!!......thanks.......I'm in love with Norah Jones. Fred, I did not know she was the daughter of the guy that taught Harrison the satir......interesting!!!!!!!you all take care......I love you.....stick around. Hope to meet all of you some day........Mr. Loveday. Good to see your post.....The Debates....got your address change.....will make the adjustment..thanks....the "257" turning inbound and climbing to 6,000ft....Lets go homr Larry....always a brother.....Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 17:38:08 (MST)
For those of you who were there for our trip to Cambodia I found a book that has a chapter called "Hot LZs". The main attraction was LZ Phillips. I am sure most of us remember it. Also talked about the large goat rope lift out of LZ Merideth when the last bunch of grunts refused to get on the aircraft. I think most of our ac were involved in that one as well. I know I was only in country about a month and thought what in the hell kind of crap did I get myself into. Anyway the book is "INTO CAMBODIA" by a guy named Keith Nolan. Published in 1990. Worth reading. Has lots of info about the political situation and how it was driving the war. Post retirement quotes by lots of senior officers about the political decisions that cost GI lives. Take care to all!
jeff sauers
USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 17:20:54 (MST)
Flight: Well Hope somebody is seeing sunshine out there!!! We have had our share of the rain. And, now the snow. And these people don't do good in snow. These folks started hitting the grocery stores early this morning. Well max don't remember the 498th dustoff, except for at Lane. Don't know ware the came in country at. You were right. 65-66 we did it out all. We evacuated wounded and brought out the kia's, back to friendly LZ'S. As Charlie knocks down the bus rates for the planned trips at Atlanta. I will post all the info on the Flight Log. And, will get registration forms for thoses whom aren't VHCMA members. EVE OF DESTRUCTION by Barry McGuire, yes Fred S. listen to it every stop on the way acrossed the big pond in 65. Take Care Brothers And Sisters. Alex
Alex <afernwal@midsouth.rr.com>
Memphis, TN USA - Monday, February 24, 2003 at 15:13:16 (MST)
Marky Mark...I didn`t see your posting.....Eminem is a wannabe What........a rapper....now he is a rapper for sure.... he`s the real deal....But the kid was raised in inner city Detroit. He just learn to emulate his environment that`s all. He`s just "white boy" doin good in rap music, that mean we be comin up in the world of rap.LOL. What kind of statement does Ozzy Osborne make to the youth. Take shit loads of acid and drink yourself stupid and be like the Oz. LOL. Like my father use to say, "Them damn long haired Beatles are just a bunch of noise". Pretty good noise and they just emulated american black R&B when they first started. Sheryl Crow...Does that mean that Barry McGuire should not have written "Eve of Distruction". No a wannabe is something different.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 23, 2003 at 23:21:45 (MST)
Noah Jones...Had the CD for about 9 months, it`s Kim`s favorite...You she is don`t you...She`s Ravi Shankar daughter the India sitar player...He played with the Beatles back in the day. She does one hell of a job of Hank Williams song " Cold Cold Heart" on her CD. She`s on a "jazz label". I like that little Michelle Branch, she does that song"The Game of Love" with Carlos Santana....But Ms. Jones is gonna be something....she`s the whip. Got out my Big Bertha today and drove some golf balls. At first they told me I couldn`t go on the golf course with Levi`s. I told them my Silver Tab Levi`s cost more that those "yuppie ass" Dockers they were wearing. And my Nike cross trainer tennis shoes cost more than most goofy lookin golf shoes and my Boston Red Sox baseball cap was a classic "75" edition. They let me go on the "driving range" that`s all wanted. And this was a "public course", Man...I`v e played in "cut offs" on public courses in Ohio. But it was a nice day today in Carolina...Little windy...But by "Ohio Standards" a nice day for February.....Talk to North Witcher tonight for about 2 hours...it was great talking to him....North is a simulator instructor for United Airlines....He was my AC for my last two months in country....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 23, 2003 at 22:12:52 (MST)
/////anybody watchin' the Grammy's??????.....Norah Jones....WOW!!!!!...ifin' ya aint ever heard her stuff.....go and get it.....LP is titled "Come Away With Me".......all love songs....such a wonderful voice.......even does a old Hank Williams song titled " Cold,Cold Heart"...........she beat out Eminm.OR M&M....(some wanna be).or what ever that guys name is....and hope to beat out the panty waist, silk pants wearing Sharrel Crow and her "ANTI WAR MOVEMENT".......I dont want war either.....hate to see a brother loose his brother.........but damit.....wrap yourself with the flag that gives us our Freedom. The one you men and gals defended. and the one that draped Larry's casket on the way back Home...... Bless all of you.......Hey!!!!!guess what????.....it's snowing in Ohio again........Always a brother. Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Sunday, February 23, 2003 at 21:13:01 (MST)
Hi flight, I remember FEB 23 1967. WE WERE IN tAY Ninh it was hot and we check temperture in med tent. it was 123 0n 23rd , that aways stayed in my mind=about a month earlier at Kontum it was in lower 40"s when we go out at about 6:00 A. M.
J.W Wilson
USA - Sunday, February 23, 2003 at 19:57:38 (MST)
Fred Alvis, my old friend, I am with Gale. How many Bud lites & any wacky weed?? We finally got winter here. I know you have more snow there, about 8-10 inches here but drifting a lot. Right at this moment it is -2 below zero with a wind nnw at 18mph giving us that lovely Pahoa, Hawaii wind chill of -24 degrees below zero ( Animal That is all the jealousy i can muster). Really though I know a lot of folks back east have been hurt badly by some of this & as Dave Powers says: We could use some more as we have been in a Draught for 2 years. The weather is turning real strange because of el Nina I guess. But Fred Alvis, there ain't one damn daffodil in sight. This has been your instant weather report from Sheridan , Wyoming. Mr. & Mrs. Debates probably have about the same or a little worse. Later, Smitty
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, Wy. USA - Sunday, February 23, 2003 at 15:37:04 (MST)
look out gale, more snows a comming.If u look next to a warm house foundation, I think u will also find some poking their little yellow heads up.Take care gale,,at least 2 more storms headed this way this week.
USA - Sunday, February 23, 2003 at 07:08:51 (MST)
Alvis. I'm kinda worried 'bout ya my friend.....how many "Bud Lites" did you have before you saw those Daffodills & Lilacs dancin' around outside? Bet you don't see them tomorrow....if you do, they'll be freezin' their little buds off! :o] I agree though, a couple of warm days and we get excited. Thursday I washed Debbies car and then I got my Pony Car out of the garage and washed it. I sure wanted to put the top down and take a cruise. Anyway, here we are again with snow on the ground and cold. I also grilled some pork chops outside, but, I do that a lot during the winter. Talk about ways for relaxing...I throw something on the grill, crank up the Sansui in the garage and down a few brewskies, now that's relaxin'. I'm not to be bothered for 'bout an hour while my little "purging ritual" is goin on.....works for me! John Dillman, good hearing from you. Just wanted to make that you received my stuff. Rick, Larry and others out west in the warmer climates.....ya sure know how to hurt us! ;o( Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 17:21:12 (MST)
"Dust-offs? We don't need no stinking dust-offs!" (Grin) As far as I can recall, in '66/early '67 we (129th, 117th, 48th) did all the med-evacs for the units we were supporting in the 2nd Corp area. I've checked the web sites for the 498th, but can't tell when they first were stationed at Pleiku (before they went to Lane). I could be wrong, of course — maybe Alex will remember better. We even did a few in the 1st Corp area, for the Marines. They weren't able to fly into some of the areas we could, due to the large size of their choppers (Sea Stallions?) and restrictive regs, so we made a couple of med-evacs for them, and, man, did the Marine pilots hate to see us dropping off Marine casualties! They hated to see the Army pulling out *their* grunts!
Max Whittington
USA - Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 17:07:07 (MST)
Flight, We would appreciate any snow/rain/sleet you can send us here in Western Colorado! It's been a DRY winter... The farmers are real afraid of another dry summer!
Dave Powers <powers@montrose.net>
Montrose, Colorado USA - Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 16:25:14 (MST)
Flight...Just got back from the "Music Store", I`ve been trying to find this CD for a while...It`s called;( Billy Bang: Vietnam: The Aftermath), it`s really some nice stuff...now he`s a violin player...Jazz Fusion( mix of rock and jazz) if your a music buff as I am. get I`m going to put bio up for you all to read....He is a Nam Vet................................................................................................................................................................................. Billy Bang aka. William Vincent Walker Although he plays an instrument that's more closely identified with up-town concert halls than downtown jazz clubs, there's no mistaking the primary source of Billy Bang's musical inspiration. While his violin technique is extensive and his familiarity with contemporary classical forms apparent, Bang's rough-edged, sometimes almost guttural tone, his old-fashioned sense of swing, and his lexicon of vocalic expressive devices define him as a jazz musician. Bang improvises lines that might have been lifted straight from a George Crumb composition, yet he invests them with an emotionalism and spontaneity that is unique to jazz. Whether in the abstract (as a solo violinist, elaborating on skeletal melodic material) or as part of a greater whole (with Sun Ra's Arkestra, for example), a Bang performance is always awash with surprise. Bang was born in Alabama as Billy Walker, but as an infant moved with his mother to Harlem. Bang was a small youngster, so when he evinced an interest in music as a junior high student, he was given a violin. About this time he began being called Billy Bang after a cartoon character. Prompted by a fascination with Afro-Cuban rhythms, he switched to percussion in the early '60s. As a hardship student at a Massachusetts prep school, Bang played drums with his fellow student, the folksinger Arlo Guthrie. Bang was drafted into the service and was sent to Vietnam. He became radicalized upon returning to the U.S. and worked in the anti-war movement. Bang began playing music again in the late '60s. Bang was inspired by the free jazz of the mid-'60s, especially the music of John Coltrane and Ornette Coleman. The influence of germinal free jazz violinist Leroy Jenkins (and Coleman's violin work) led Bang back to his original instrument. Bang studied with Jenkins and involved himself with the burgeoning New York free jazz scene. He collaborated with saxophonists Sam Rivers and Frank Lowe and performed often in the downtown lofts that often housed the avant-garde music of the day. Bang formed his own group -- the Survival Ensemble -- in the early '70s. In 1977, Bang co-founded (with bassist John Lindberg and guitarist James Emery) the String Trio of New York. It was for his work with the latter group that Bang became best known (he left the band in 1986). He also played with bassist Bill Laswell's Material and drummer Ronald Shannon Jackson's Decoding Society, and led his own groups. In the mid-'80s, Bang played briefly with a funk band called Forbidden Planet. He also collaborated on various projects with pianist Marilyn Crispell, trumpeter Don Cherry, and guitarist James "Blood" Ulmer. In the '90s, Bang fronted his own ensembles and occasionally led ad hoc groups on record dates. A 1992 session with Sun Ra (on what was possibly Ra's last recording), bassist John Ore, and drummer Andrew Cyrille produced Tribute to Stuff Smith (Soul Note). Bang recorded Spirits Gathering -- with a band that included the drummer Dennis Charles -- for the CIMP label in 1996. The next year, he made his most straight-ahead jazz album, Bang On!, for Justin Time. That same year, he recorded Commandment (for the sculpture of Alain Kirili), an album of solo violin, for Alan Schneider's NoMore label. Chris Kelsey Related styles: Free Jazz | Jazz - general | Rock
Fred Skaggs
USA - Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 15:05:59 (MST)
thanks for the kind thoughts rick, ole buddy.Was good to meet u and hope u return to kokomo this year.Had alot of fun and laughs with u guys (and girls).Man is it ever snowing hard outside today.arghhhhhhhhh
USA - Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 14:36:24 (MST)
Animal, did you know a pilot by the name of Stonecipher, Charles A.(stoney), or crewchief by the name of Duane Cochran. Both of these guys flew with the 498th, then came to Chu-Lai 54th Dust-Off or Chu-Lai Dust-Off as it was known. Anyway Duane and I came to the 129th in Nov.of 71. I heard from Stoney a few days ago from a post I placed on the Dust-Off web page. Duane was killed in Korea 1985. He did what most of talked about (returned from VN and went to fight school), anyway he died in a UH1 accident as a pilot. Gale Beard haven't forgot about you, just haven't had a chance to check with our VSO. I gave him your packet right after I received it from you. I'll let you know.
John Dillman <jdillman@sbcglobal.net>
liberty, mo USA - Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 08:44:08 (MST)
Fred and the rest that live in the snow country I am glad that your are seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. I hope it continues to get better. The kind of put the dampers on the gettting out in the light and feeling better. Fred I hope this will help you. Be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 06:37:02 (MST)
flash from indianapolis... i walked outside today,seen DAFFODILLS, less than an inch high, but poking up thru ground.Also seen....buds on lilacs. friends, spring is just around the corner
USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 20:49:30 (MST)
Animal(Greg), Yea the Cuyahoga River caught on fire in "68", but Cleveland redeveloped the downtown in "The Flats" it`s real nice now...yuppie haven.....if you can deal with that. I hung around with a lot of medics and crewmen of Dust-Off, they were a diffrent breed. Alot of the medic`s had went to college before the Army....and my mother owned a campus(Ohio State)bar at that time, so I related with the campus party atmosphere. That`s what it was like sometimes. Sometimes when I would come in late from flying all day and the 129th mess hall would be closed. A black cook from the 498th named Yoyi from New Orleans, would open up the 498th mess hall and make me something to eat. I`ll send you some pictures of "Dust-Off Crew". They were great people.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 13:43:10 (MST)
I didn't mean to offend, I had some great times in Cleveland just before going to Nam. I can't think of the city, however, without bringing to mind the song by Randy Newman..." Roll on big river, roll on....the lord can make you tumble, the lord can make you turn, the lord can make you overflow....but the lord can't make you burn" Fred S. were you in Dust-off? I was with the 498th before coming to the 129th, When they stood down. I really liked flying slicks. Got a lot of hours and single ship missions. Flying sling loads of rice to ROK firebases. Flew a lot with Smitty, with the occaisional hunting expedition and C.A. with respect, Greg
HI USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 13:15:15 (MST)
I`m not done yet....The Cleveland Agora....The Fillmore of The Midwest....Where the "House Band" was Terry Knight and The Pack.....The Pack was three young men from Michigan..... Mark,Don,and Mel.......Terry got tired of singing and wanted to be a "Producer"....So The Pack took a new name of " Grand Funk Railroad". How Americana does Cleveland need to be to get respect. Plus it`s the home of Pete Rhome of the 129th....President of Rolling Thunder for the state of Ohio. Give Guymen Gary,Indiana home of the Michael Jackson.........they should love him in Nigeria.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 12:19:29 (MST)
OF COURSE......I would take exception to giving away Cleveland.....The Mistake On The Lake....Home of "Rock`n Roll", Allen Freed coin the phrase there......The only city in the United States that played Little Richard`s version of "Tutti Frutti on "white radio" instead of Pat Boone`s version.....Home of the Rock`n Roll Hall of Fame..... Home of the Oldest Pro Football Team In America.....The Browns.....Home of John W. Heisman as in Heisman Trophy....Given to the best college football player every year. OBITUARY John W. Heisman, Noted Coach, Dies By THE NEW YORK TIMES ohn William Heisman, all-around authority on athletics and former football coach, died yesterday in his home at 28 East Seventieth Street after a brief illness. He was 66 years old. For the last six years he had been physical director of the Downtown Athletic Club. Mr. Heisman for more than thirty-five years was football coach at a number of leading colleges. In 1923 and 1924 he was president of the American Football Coaches Association. He was the originator of the "Heisman shift" and was said to be the first to suggest the introduction of the forward pass into football. He was also the inventor of many methods used in modern football. From 1904 to 1920 he coached football, baseball and basketball at the Georgia Institute of Technology, where he developed the famous "Golden Tornado" teams. He began his coaching career in 1892 at Oberlin College. In 1893 he coached all sports at the University of Akron. From 1895 to 1900 he coached football and baseball at Alabama Polytechnic Institute, and from 1900 to 1904 was coach at Clemson College. In 1908 he was director of athletics at the Atlanta Athletic Club. From 1910 to 1914 he was president of the Atlanta Baseball Association. In 1920 he coached football at the University of Pennsylvania and in 1923 filled the same position at Washington and Jefferson College. From 1924 to 1927 he was head football coach and director of athletics at Rice Institute, Houston, Texas. In 1888 he was a member of the Brown football team, and in 1889 of the Pennsylvania varsity football eleven. He was born in Cleveland, the son of John M. and Sarah Lehr Heisman. He was educated at Brown University and the University of Pennsylvania, where he received his LL. B. degree in 1892. Mr. Heisman was the author of "Principles of Football." As physical director of the Downtown Athletic Club, he lectured there last year at weekly football forums. He predicted then that there would be less fumbling of lateral passes this year. His widow, Mrs. Edith Maora Cole Heisman, survives. Burial will be in Rhinelander, Wis. Back to the top of this page.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 11:46:23 (MST)
Frank, Go to: http://www.vhcma.org/reunion.html for info. They don't have the daily activity info yet or reservation form for the reunion. How bout' it Alex, when are you gonna have that stuff available? Animal,I don't care about Cleveland, but, don't get too close to the "Pop A Top" in Coldwater!!! Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 09:35:13 (MST)
Morning Flight: Would someone please reprint the info on the Atlanta reunion in June? You know, what, when, where & whats going to happen each day. ANIMAL, I don't know about giving Cleveland away, someone might have a problem with that. Take care all. CLEAR!!
Frank Loveday <bluecobra@dav.net.>
Bastrop, La. USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 09:23:12 (MST)
Robbie...I guess that just re-enforces what a enigma I was in Viet-Nam, I was lowkey and soft-spoken. I didn`t bring alot of attention to myself. I observed and absorbed everything going on. Of course I was pretty socially adventurous back then....still that way. I spent a lot of time with friends at Dust-Off and had friends that worked at Lane Tower, spent alot of time there. But if I felt strong about a issue I could always take a stand intellectually...... LOL....As the words to a song once said," I Recall When Was Small ....How I Spent My Days Alone.....The Busy World Was Not For Me......So I Went And Found My Own"
Fred Skaggs
USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 09:02:52 (MST)
Alex, nice post. Looking forward to seeing you and Liz in June. Ray, Hope your feeling ok Brother. Stay on the passenger side of that truck. Rick, any news about the Butterfly lately? Fred Skaggs I never got back to you and I thank you but I have a few pictures of Dunn, and I still can't picture you. Hello to all my Brothers and the sisters that frequent this site. Hope to see most of you in Atlanta. Robbie 69/70 Bulldog265 The Judge
Rochester, NY USA - Friday, February 21, 2003 at 05:56:27 (MST)
How about this plan: We send Guymen an email; that he send us his bank account numbers, and we'll give him Cleveland............Greg
HI USA - Thursday, February 20, 2003 at 22:21:13 (MST)
GUYMAN/GUYMEN, aka MUGO GUYMAN, is part of the Nigerian scam artist scheme that sends out fraudulent emails to people, claiming that he/she needs help in transfering millions of dollars from a hidden bank acount and will give the recipient millions for helping. There are over 400 of these bastiges sending these out. Most are in Nigeria, but some are in South Africa. They get addresses from various internet guestbooks, and have hit over a thousand guestbooks, so far. The postings are so they can see that they've already been here and gotten all those email adresses available, so they know they don't need to do it again here, for awhile. (I'm listed in many places on the internet, so I get four or five of these scams sent to me each day.)
Max Whittington <Max@OregonPI.com>
USA - Thursday, February 20, 2003 at 14:40:04 (MST)
DAMN.....Ya all got Dilbert the Freak, Private Nazi and Bowana(The Rip-Off)Guymen.....To much for me.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 20, 2003 at 13:38:59 (MST)
STREET, MD USA - Thursday, February 20, 2003 at 10:52:46 (MST)
Disregard last post, turns out it's one of those urban legend hoaxes. Sorry.
Larry Kwiatkowski <chrger66@aol.com>
USA - Thursday, February 20, 2003 at 10:28:50 (MST)
PASS ON TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW A friend of mine received a telephone call last evening from an individual identifying himself as an AT&T Service technician who was conducting a test on telephone lines. He stated that to complete the test he should touch nine(9), zero(0), the pound sign (#), and then hang up. Luckily, I was suspicious and refused. Upon contacting the telephone company, he was informed that by pushing 90#, you give the requesting individual full access to your telephone line, which enables them to place long distance calls billed to your home phone number. He was further informed that this scam has been originating from many local jails/prisons. He has also verified this information with UCB Telecom, Pacific Bell, MCI, Bell Atlantic and GTE. Please beware. DO NOT press 90# for ANYONE. The GTE Security Department requested that he share this information with EVERYONE he knows. PLEASE pass this on to everyone YOU know. If you have mailing lists and/or newsletters from organizations you are connected with, I encourage you to pass on this information to them. After checking with Verizon they said it was true, so do not dial (9), zero(0), the pound sign # and hang up for anyone. PLEASE PASS ON TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW
Larry Kwiatkowski <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, CA USA - Wednesday, February 19, 2003 at 23:18:16 (MST)
Fred alvis, If you want to read someting like that, just like put playboy inside "field & stream" or something like that. Know what I mean.:) :) :), later, Jim
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, Wy. USA - Wednesday, February 19, 2003 at 21:57:45 (MST)
perhaps, but u try and kick any of this family in the butt and the rest will beat u to ur knees
USA - Wednesday, February 19, 2003 at 20:46:54 (MST)
hey, thanks for all the good commo thrown my way. found out many things i didnt know.Sunlight, ot light bit makes alot of sense when one thinks about it. tyAlso seen alot of humor in here today..chuckle, thats the best medicine for me,short term.Whats most importnat to me is knowing that we all have shared this problem and i am not alone. Thank you my brothers. Still chuckling over keeps the news off tv, and that bit about almost up to 70.Smitty, will they let me read things like....he leaned her up against the fire hydrant, her 8 breast gleamed in the moon light..oops, thats wrong book.come on sunshine.
USA - Wednesday, February 19, 2003 at 12:26:26 (MST)
Great tins (This Is No Shit). Thanks Alex. Its good to hear from you. Flight be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Wednesday, February 19, 2003 at 09:32:12 (MST)
Flight: Alot of como lately. But, I see conflict in some of the postings, this is not good!! Mark put this web site here for the 129th. So, Brother's whom served with the 129th and Family members and friends of ours and our MIA/KIA's would have a place to find each other. True, not everyone whom visit this site served in Vietnam and true doesn't know how we each feel with the emotions we hold inside. But, we all are connected through a 129th Brother. And most of them were our KIA's. These folks are in support of our veterans and us. I always wondered why I came home?? I like all of you at any second could have been killed. But, why did I make it home. Well a few weeks ago at work, a man need a battery installed for his daughter's car. As I was helping him, he asked who owned the truck with the Vietnam stickers on. I told him it was mine. Come to find out, this Vietnam Vet was one of the first of the wounded out of LZ XRAY. He had the same thoughts for years. He answer to me was. We came home to keep the memory of our MIA/KIA's alive and not let them be forgotten. Vietnam Vets are dying at a fast pace. The friends of the 129th whom visit this site. Are not trying to walk in our shoes, but,trying to give thier support to us. We are family here. When someone is down, we need to be there to lift them up and give our support. Mark's vision has made a reality for alot of the 129th members. And with his and the webmaster(David) help. We have had some great reunions. Yes!! emotions and tears do come about. But, were there with ours Brothers,Family and Friends. I hope we all can go on to enjoy this site. An Welcome all our Brothers ,Family and friends of the 129th. I have had the opportunity of meeting most of you. Brothers that served the country with 129th!! Tom you have come along way from the Phoenix Reunion. And hope you will agree that we must take it one step at a time. If any one thing made my Phoenix reunion was you coming. I thank you for that. Cupps is another,my first meeting with you, I will never forget. Just remember my Brothers, family and friends of the 129th. We are Family!! Mark& Family and David Thanks for your hard work and Devotion to this site. Alex 129th 65-68 VHCMA President 2002-2003
Alex <afernwal@midsouth.com>
Memphis, TN USA - Wednesday, February 19, 2003 at 09:09:03 (MST)
Fred Alvis....Tom and Jim W. is so right...it`s a fact....theory arose from Stanford University studies....Just like in factories they tested colors of paint, to improve production and attidtudes of the workers. It was called the Hawthorne Effect. All that bad weather is depressing!!!! Music is all I listen to...from the time I get up in the morning until late at night. That`s why I`m such jazz freak..it`s mostly instrumental....no lyrics.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Wednesday, February 19, 2003 at 00:20:32 (MST)
Fred, Tom Shanahan is quite correct, we have a large Box with a bank of high powered lights here at the Sheridan VA that is used almost constantly for that. Vets will come in & sit under it with it behind them & read for 1 hour a day, seems to help, was developed i believe on the west coast years ago where there is not a lot of Sun. Seattle or Portland. A Guy who works at home Depot & is handy could like build one. Later, Jim
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, wy USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 23:22:09 (MST)
Man oh man, I'm so tired of winter. I'll bet it didn't get over 70 degrees today. Had to put on socks with my shorts today to help keep warm. Had to keep the lid on the bar-b-q closed. hehehe. Anyhow, Hobie, glad you remembered the knife incident. I still laugh about that one. I can't remember who it was except he was a big, blond guy from the midwest somewhere. I've got some pictures of him. What made it so funny was that he considered himself a cowboy type and to quote him "Let me show you city boys how to handle a knife." Then he proceeded to stab himself in the foot. Cracked me up! Anyhow, y'all have a good one and try to stay warm. (Scooter)
Larry Kwiatkowski <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, CA USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 22:17:00 (MST)
Fred Alvis - One of the things that helps fight off depression is natural light. Sunlight and a clear day is best but full spectrum lighting indoors can help also. GE Reveal light bulbs (the blue ones) seem to work pretty well. Turning on the lights inside the house helps. Full spectrum or natural light seems to help the production of the neurotransmitter serotonin. Or in doctor speak: Decreased serotoninergic neurotransmission has been proposed to play a key role in the aetiology of depression. Took somebody nine years of med school to be able to talk like that - unbelievable. Anyway turning on the lights, lots of light, seems to help me. Standard indoor fluorescent lighting does not seem to help. Oh, and kill the television. Especially the news.
Tom Shanahan
USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 21:51:34 (MST)
Hi flight, I live in a remote part of county where the only internet you can have is by telephone hook up, the line runs under the river and has been meesed up for a few days until to day. I enjoying reading this flight log and I wanted to slap the guy in "forrest Gump" who called him a "baby killer". I raised hogs for many years untill big companies made it hard to make any money.Carring for livestock help me get over depression of nam.Fred I will let you know when I go to Wilimgton again. I Work for Weyerhauser maintaince and work most Sundays.
J.W. Wilson <kas3@ncfreedom.net>
USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 20:43:37 (MST)
FRED ALVIS: The ugly black overwhelming depression that comes out of no where and sucks the soul right out of you?? Yes, I know what you're speaking of. So do alot of others. If you're interested in avenues for methods of controling it, e mail me and I'll share what I've learned. You are right. It is a very familiar symptom among Vietnam Veterans.
Fred Brown <FJBuffalo@Yahoo.com>
USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 17:18:54 (MST)
thanks smitty.
USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 16:16:40 (MST)
Observer, wow...that really makes one stop and think. Always interesting. Gently
Gently <jsinger@uwm.edu>
USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 15:05:04 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
Folks, & I sent this to you Animal & Hope you got the message. If you get a virus, there is a website called --- getvirushelp.com --- in there, this man has a number of cleaners for viruses & if you scroll down the middle of the page it has the Klez virus & if you click on the Blue title it will discuss what it is & on the right side has some instructions for removal. This site is in league with mcafee & Norton & i think it is a good one. I used it to get the KAK worm off my computer a few years ago. Good luck. Smitty
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, Wy. USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 14:25:05 (MST)
i also forgot to add ..sometimes a smoldering anger too. We were sprayed and betrayed , my brothers.
USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 10:36:49 (MST)
having worked a Lowes home improvement for a while now, i wasnt surprised by the way or speed we ran out of 100 mph tape, nor plastic sheeting.When 911 happened, there was a run on resperators, mask that painters use, anything to filter air. By the way, the french did beat the germans in ww1. They lost an entire generation of men. Can that be called a victory when everyone u know is dead or crippled?perhaps they didnt want a repeat of that in ww 2. Question. Does anyone still have to deal with depression? The big , black,all incompassing type?I try very hard not to, but at times its just to strong to withstand.Am i alone in this?Its very dangerous for us nam vets to get this wayI thinks its an ongoing battle many of us have experinced.Bottles and drugs dont work, just adds more pain.I am ok today, but my brothers,when or who will it hit next?This place keeps me sane, please remember that.chuckle. or it helps.when i see anger in here, i cringe, this isnt the place for it.All of u take care.
USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 10:19:24 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
- Observer Post Removed -
STREET , MD USA - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 07:29:32 (MST)
Animal, I took my R&R at Hawaii in January 1968. My wife met me there (which was a mistake, but, that's another story)and the weather was beautiful. I remember renting a 67 Mustang and driving to Diamond Head and to the Punch Bowl. I had a rough time getting back to the 129th due to the Tet Offensive just getting started. A chopper picked me up at Cam Rhan Bay and the ride back to Lane was pretty spooky. I'd never seen so many tracers in the sky over such a big area. We knew it was a celebration, but, they were all around us and I'm sure there was some aiming for us. There was a Hawaiian guy in the 129th by the name of Anson Nazarro (67-68). He's in our contacts, but, his e-mail comes back. I'm not sure where he's at now.......how 'bout checking out the area for him? Later bro, Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Tuesday, February 18, 2003 at 06:18:20 (MST)
Hello again, Just to clear something up; I closed my last posting with "death to those who would harm inocents...." I was talking about terrorists, be they Islamic, Irish, Racist or whatever. Other than that I'm all peace and love. Flight, I'm afraid to e-mail any of you directly as I suspect I have a Klez(?) worm in my computer. I hope it can only be passed through my e-mail server and not this log. Please advise. I hope all of you in the east are warm and cozyin spite of the blizzard. It did snow here on the Big Island this weekend,(On top of Mauna Kea- 13'000 ft). However I recomend this season to visit Hawaii as it's a cool 68 this afternoon. I live in the Puna District of the the Island of Hawaii. This is where "Puna Butter" is grown and also the poorest and most rural part of the Hawaiian Islands. The dynamics of living on an active volcano keep property values down, and also development down. That makes this area pristine and the most like "old Hawaii". Aloha nui loa, Greg H. "Animal"
HI USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 21:22:35 (MST)
Looking forward to the reunion and Kokomo. That'll be great time getting together. Yea!I planted my garden today tomatoes mild and hot chiles. Squash and melons next week. Getting the cane pole jerks I am ready to go fishing. The Largemouth bass are spawning and making nests ready to drag those plastics and pissing off those females which I am good at.HEHEHEHE Claudia and I have been married 33 years this week. I guess I don't piss them off to bad. HEHEHE If possible get your before and after pics to David the webmaster. Flight be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 18:33:34 (MST)
Kim.....A baseball player died today in Spring training!!!! Baltimore rookie pitcher. It should start breaking out like spring down here in a couple of weeks, I Hope....Last year at this time it middle 60`s. In basic I had some dental work done on CS day, and missed the whole thing. Never had to do it. I played basketball mostly in basic, C-5-1 Tank Hill,Ft. Jackson S.C. We won the post championship, Jerry Francis, a high school All-American, from U of Dayton was in basic with me. He went in Special Services after MP training in Ft.Gordon, GA. He played for the US Army team...draftee. As usual I was the only "white guy" on the team.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 17:36:31 (MST)
Our season's...Almost winter, winter, getting over winter, black fly season, return to winter, hotter than hell. (two weeks), almost winter, again..... I'm not sure about Atlanta, it's softball season up here, start of tournament time, leading up to the nationals in August. I quit drinking years ago, found out the stuff is stronger than me. Quiet nights by the campfire just aren't the same...memories........I was an oddball, CS barely made me cough, watered my eyes a little, other's were gagging their lungs out, very strange indeed...My claim to fame with gas was getting pissed at some guy in the 61st, going to my ship and firing a cs grenade over the hill at them..I wonder if the thing would have killed anybody if it had hit them??? The tower guards did me a favor, denied hearing the thing go off.......Fall, 71.
Kim La Voie
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 17:12:34 (MST)
good to hear, dennis and good point u bring up. If i must enjoy 'hotlanta'i too, will try to make it on a saterday.Perhaps all those that can only make it for one day, try to aim for saterday.I missed a few by hours at louisville. which is my loss.hopes to see u all there.
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 16:18:18 (MST)
Hello Flight, now that I have calmed down, it is with great displeasure that I must inform that I will not be able to attend Atlanta 03 due to Family and employer priorities. I will try to sneak away on friday afternoon and at least be there for Saturday. Keep the faith all Dennis 71-72
Dennis Fuerstenau <dfuerst_2000@netzero.net>
FL USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 15:48:37 (MST)
Dennis Fuerstenau <dfuerst_2000@netzero.net>
FL USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 15:44:57 (MST)
Here's what I think; This great country was concieved out of protest, and that's what makes it so great. What happens to someone in Iraq or North Korea who critisizes their nations policies? The problem with the anti-war movement of the sixties is they forgot to separate the warriors from the politicians. I like to think that our men and women in the military are putting themselves in harms way to,among other things, insure our right to peacefully protest the government. Peace...Love.....and death to those who would harm innocents to further their cause. With respect, Animal
HI USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 14:45:14 (MST)
thanks gale.Am looking forward to a warm summers nite, round a camp fire, cold beer,good friends, and yes, 2am drunken stories about anything.beats the silence of the " before years "when all my 129th family where "somewhere" out there.Fuss, fight,scratch and bite, its still good to hear.I myself like comming in here as i am sure everyone does.We are a fircely independent group. GROUP. we are also of many minds,all with tender spots.In this site, i thought i had found safty.friendship and i foruem. I have found my best friend in vietnam here and for that i am greatful.It answered a question,an old question,that has nagged me for years.I await more friends to find this site and I hope once more the sun is shinning in here.To mant clouds of discontent, winds of disharmony,and the rains of anger.Thinks we should all look back to the day we first hit the send button with a wonderous,trembling finger.I friends, still feel that.As someone once said...u can buy the dog, but kindness makes it wag its tail. Jim Westwang...sometimes in the next few years, i am going to make it a point of seeing you.I can still whip ur butt in a game of spades.Hopefully, we will have news of gabby. dang, i am rambling again..see u guys in a bit
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 14:33:08 (MST)
Yup, Atlanta then Kokomo!!!! We have a lot to look forward to. Always there-Gently
Genlty <jsinger@uwm.edu>
Home, USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 14:06:13 (MST)
Alvis, here it is Buddy: Sept 19-21, 2003 http://www.hcvvo.org/reunion.html
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 12:15:57 (MST)
I'm bringing more beer too....and a gas mask! Rick says that he may drive here this year. If he does , he'll probably visit with everyone. I told him he's welcome at my place for stay. I'll try to find something more on Kokomo. Gale
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 11:58:07 (MST)
laughing with gale. You going to be thereagain this year buddy? do you know when it is? i need to request time off, and need to do it soon.Gently said it was in semptember, but didnt know what week it was.3rd week end? I know more now, so will bring more than just beer next time.will bring rain suit also..chuckle
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 11:21:30 (MST)
Alvis, That comment about CS kinda reminds me of Kokomo!!! Who was that masked man? Good thing he wasn't any closer to the campfire! ;o))) C'mon spring!! Gale
Clinton, In US of A - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 10:50:24 (MST)
hey rick, buddy. Tell what warmth and sunshine feels like. Dang, its been so cold for so long, i think i might aply for alaskian relife funds.Would love to hit the lotto...sighs, fingers trailing thru blue, warm waters,sails ruffleing in the wind, hearing birds call to one another....my luck, jaws would see my fingers and think its dinner time. Ask my 129th family picture this.... that dang drill sargents grin as he watch us stagger from the cs hut , pukeing and crying,coughing wiping nose that had legs it was running so fast. My, my, they were a sadistical bunch. chuckling as i look back on it.
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 10:41:24 (MST)
Fred, damn it! Now you've gotten me angry! Who in the hell made you web master? And where in the hell do you get off attacking, yes, attacking anyone who has an opinion different than yours on the 129th web site! Fred you and I are on the same page politically, but your freedom of speech is too pointed and way to angry. Calm it down, or we're going to lose more people from our web site, note "our" web site. Now get a handle on things and CALM DOWN both your words and tones, when differing with anyone on the site. You respond as though only your opinion matters and that we should all look toward you for some kind of leadership. The web site is becoming very un-welcoming, and lacking in being able to express individual opinions. I'm very angry and I can't believe I"m the only one who's asking you take it easy!!!! Geez! And don't do anything self-pitying like tell the web that you're no longer going to post because you make people angry....please, we are all adults, and in most cases could see right through that. So, please just continue posting, but stop being such a ass. Judith Singer Advising Assistant School of Architecture and Urban Planning jsinger@uwm.edu << Previous Next >>
Fred Skaggs
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 09:25:17 (MST)
whooo hooooo supposed to be in 40s tomorrow. Hasnt snowed here for hours.fed ex plane just slid off runway here, its still a mess,but, whoo hoo, going to be in the 40s.Now, wheres those darn spring flowers? hey, spring is 5 weeks away..whooo hooo. <<< was told why blind people dont sky dive.... scares the heck out of the dogs. Fred Scaggs....warmer weather coming ur way buddy. <<< has lived near Smitty up there is wyoming, smile, brrrrrrr.hey kim, is it true there are two seasons there? winter and black fly season? Did a construction job near Maine border years ago...last concrete pour was xmas eve in raging snow storm brrrrr to kim also.
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 07:36:05 (MST)
Yea Kim....N.C. is a mess down here.....None of the power outages to the extreme it was in December. It`s Jefferson Davis Day down here.....schools are closed. It`s not bad as far as temperture. It`s been a tuff winter down here......they can`t play golf.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 07:08:52 (MST)
Smitty...dont read any animosity into my ramblings...I enjoy reading other perspectives, it makes me examine my own beliefs. Aside from daydreaming about fully developed girls and young female teachers, my favorite subject in school was debating.....HEAT WAVE!!!! it's above zero this morning!!!!!News is about hte big blizard in DC. Hell, with all the hot air in that area, it will all be melted by noon!....by the way, who remembers all the dash pages in the log book?
USA - Monday, February 17, 2003 at 06:21:57 (MST)
Jim W.....Like I said,"Nothing Personal"....Just was a bit much to digest with Sunday morning breakfast. I went back and forth on it couple of times....to make sure if that was YOU or just a paragraph that you were passing on to the web-site. Also you write alot more in control than that. I was thinking for a minute,"Damn...I wouldn`t want be in a VA Hospital with this nurse, he`d pull the plug on the machine on my ass....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 16, 2003 at 23:19:48 (MST)
Folks, this was an attack on no one. I simply passed on a reading that was sent to me for perusal. Do not necessarily even agree with everything but evidently have angered some people & rest assured that was not my intent. My best to all, Smitty
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, Wy. USA - Sunday, February 16, 2003 at 22:44:17 (MST)
HHHMMMM......history is full of stories,where one side did fight back, jsut as it's full of stories where one side didn't. I wonder where it all became Billy Clinton's fault??? I think osama declared war on America after Georgie the elder had American troops ( infidels) step on Arab soil! I kinda believe that the animosity toward anything western started back about the time of the Jewish state, if not long before! It's kinda like the bible.....people tend to pick the parts that suit their purposes, and ignore the rest! Don't think for one minute that I have any love for osama, I believe it's up to this country to find his raggedy ass, capture him, alive, and bring him to justice. Georgie Junior declared war on him, remember the Geneva Convention? If he surrenders, we can't just kill him....thanks to the excesses of the CIA back a bunch of years ago, it's against the law to assassinate people, just bacause we don't like them.....I wonder if the out of shape Marine is fond of ronnie raygun, no one seems too upset that he let 281 Marines get killed in Lebanon..no one even mentions the 220 who died in Gander Newfoundland, after their civilian airliner was blown up...anybody other than me even remember that one????....I feel an eerie sense of Deja Vu..we have to destroy the village, in order to save it......are we giving away our freedom's, just to keep them? I fought for this?????...Who knows. maybe jonny ashole...er...moussilini... er...ashcroft is going to take away my computer, and lock me up, just to keep America safe for REAL American's!!!!!!! Seriously, I've come to believe that there are two types of bad guys in the world...the good bad guys, who do business with American Businessmen, and the bad bad guys, who don't
Kim La Voie
USA - Sunday, February 16, 2003 at 19:00:54 (MST)
Interesting....But I`m not going to inflame the entire 129th Web-site with a rebutal. But as a friend said before, It`s the a-typical 2:00AM bar ranting. I thought a articulate and caring man like yourself would be more original. Sounds good...but has no substance. I`m Not Forgetting!!!!!!! Nothing Personal.......
Fred Skaggs <ac459429@earthlink.net>
Raleigh, OH USA - Sunday, February 16, 2003 at 15:47:07 (MST)
Folks, I sent this to a lot of you individually but for the rest, Here it goes as passed on to me by a friend: "DO NOT FORGET" I sat in a movie theater watching "Schindler's List," asked myself, "Why didn't the Jews fight back?" Now I know why. I sat in a movie theater, watching "Pearl Harbor" and asked myself, "Why weren't we prepared?" Now I know why. Civilized people cannot fathom, much less predict, the actions of evil people. On September 11, dozens of capable airplane passengers allowed themselves to be overpowered by a handful of poorly armed terrorists because they did not comprehend the depth of hatred that motivated their captors. On September 11, thousands of innocent people were murdered because too many Americans naively reject the reality that some nations are dedicated to the dominance of others. Many political pundits, pacifists and media personnel want us to forget the carnage. They say we must focus on the bravery of the rescuers and ignore the cowardice of the killers. They implore us to understand the motivation of the perpetrators. Major television stations have announced they will assist the healing process by not replaying devastating footage of the planes crashing into the Twin Towers. I will not be manipulated. I will not pretend to understand. I will not forget. I will not forget the liberal media who abused freedom of the press to kick our country when it was vulnerable and hurting. I will not forget that CBS anchor Dan Rather preceded President Bush's address to the nation with the snide remark, "No matter how you feel about him, he is still our president." I will not forget that ABC TV anchor Peter Jennings questioned President Bush's motives for not returning immediately to Washington, DC and commented, "We're all pretty skeptical and cynical about Washington." And I will not forget that ABC's Mark Halperin warned if reporters weren't informed of every little detail of this war, they aren't "likely -- nor should they be expected -- to show deference." I will not isolate myself from my fellow Americans by pretending an attack on the USS Cole in Yemen was not an attack on the United States of America. I will not forget the Clinton administration equipped Islamic terrorists and their supporters with the world's most sophisticated telecommunications equipment and encryption technology, thereby compromising America's ability to trace terrorist radio, cell phone, land lines, faxes and modem communications. I will not be appeased with pointless, quick retaliatory strikes like those perfected by the previous administration. I will not be comforted by "feel-good, do nothing" regulations like the silly "Have your bags been under your control?" question at the airport. I will not be influenced by so called,"antiwar demonstrators" who exploit the right of expression to chant anti-American obscenities. I will not forget the moral victory handed the North Vietnamese by American war protesters who reviled and spat upon the returning soldiers, airmen, sailors and Marines. I will not be softened by the wishful thinking of pacifists who chose reassurance over reality. I will embrace the wise words of Prime Minister Tony Blair who told Labor Party conference, "They have no moral inhibition on the slaughter of the innocent. If they could have murdered not 7,000 but 70,000, does anyone doubt they would have done so and rejoiced in it? There is no compromise possible with such people, no meeting of minds, no point of understanding with such terror. Just a choice: defeat it or be defeated by it. And defeat it we must!" I will force myself to: -hear the weeping -feel the helplessness -imagine the terror -sense the panic -smell the burning flesh - experience the loss - remember the hatred. I sat in a movie theater, watching "Private Ryan" and asked myself, "Where did they find the courage?" Now I know. We have no choice. Living without liberty is not living. -- Ed Evans, USMC (Ret.) Not as lean, Not as mean, But still a Marine. Keep this going until every living American has read it and memorized it so we don't make the same mistake again. LET US NOT FORGET With my respects; smitty
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, Wy. USA - Sunday, February 16, 2003 at 09:02:05 (MST)
Kim I think I told him when I talked to him on the phone. He sent me pics when he crewed 431.
Rick England
USA - Sunday, February 16, 2003 at 08:16:55 (MST)
Kim LaVoie....You can even put that deep New England accent down in writing....Fred A....Ronald Rayguns.....You still have that Woodstock feeling..... Yea...Ronnie Reagan sure killed the labor movement.....but it`s like a pendulum....it will swing back....people can`t work and make a living at $7.50 a hour. Boy George loves to call that a working wage. That`s not gonna but your gas in a few months. Gang...I`m gonna write one more story here and that will be it for me forever.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Saturday, February 15, 2003 at 21:32:25 (MST)
AYUH, I'm a MAINUH, fur showah. Been here most of my life. I feel a road trip coming on! Roger Austin, who lives in Pittston, crewed 431 for a while. I'll have to get a hold of him and let him know. Is it there in Bangor for a while yet? I'll try and swing by, one of these days when I head ovah to Bah Habbah!....Fred A. I agree, the ATC strike was a declaration of open season on working people all over this country. Ever since, it's been one get rich quick scheme after another for the business community...Milkin, Ican, Dunlap, Georges, Lay.....got everyone looking at the push on stocks, instead of dividends. Just a legalized pyriamid scheme, and the real losers are the workers. Kim
Kim La Voie <kimlav@megalink.net>
Livermore, Me USA - Saturday, February 15, 2003 at 13:23:41 (MST)
Larry, good to talk to you too! Thanks for your input regarding the gas mission. Regarding the knife...as I recall, we were staying the night at Phu Hep enroute to Lane. You, me, Steve Young, John Martin, and another guy...kinda large in stature who went to the Cobras...were gathered in a room. The large guy got out the survival knife and was showing it off. HE dropped it on his foot and didn’t say a word as blood oozed up through the top of his boot; I think he needed stitches to patch himself up...welcome to Nam. Jeff...you deserve it my friend...And actually never thought about it, but don't remember what happend to the gasmask...maybe its still in that rice paddy!! Have a great weekend, all... Hobie
Jim Jobe <pavelowrider@networld.com>
USA - Saturday, February 15, 2003 at 13:22:13 (MST)
kim lavoie-your up here in maine? you know old 431 is here in bangor?-Richard DEEMI SAR
Richard Bowie <cencom@juno.com>
bangor, me USA - Saturday, February 15, 2003 at 10:02:33 (MST)
i think the country ( work place wise) has gone down hill ever since ronald "rayguns" busted the air traffic controllers union.
USA - Saturday, February 15, 2003 at 09:29:55 (MST)
Hobie, Thanks for the kudos. I had not commented since the personal e-mail you sent me was more than thanks enough. Didn't know the part about Rene. I will add I don't think I ever got that mask back. Wonder if I owe the Army for it? Take care, Snapper
jeff sauers
USA - Saturday, February 15, 2003 at 08:45:04 (MST)
Hey Fred...up here we have the Manchester.N.H. Union Leader to read when we want to get the latest from the `ranting right"The Bangor Daily News isn't a whole lot better.....I just love it when the loonies attack the `Left Wing Press'...Kinda...if you have no defense, attack!.....I keep getting internet legends about ollie north and his grilling by Al Gore...they tend to forget that Ronnie Reagan was in office back then, and HE didn't seem be able to rid the world of osama, either!...Our state has lost at least 20 wood turning mills, which are the center of most of the small towns up here, a couple paper mills are down, all due to foreign competition. I don't think that iraq is the most important problem in those folks lives! We've been in the deep freeze for a few days now...twenty eight below this morning, twenty two below yesterday. At least the shit weather is getting pushed below us!!
Kim La Voie
USA - Saturday, February 15, 2003 at 06:31:27 (MST)
Sorry Mark, I get a little work up, I just think any vet should have "priority hire" on any job. Plus I call the Columbus Dispatch the Columbus Disgrace....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Friday, February 14, 2003 at 20:24:13 (MST)
Hobie, you weren't by chance the guy who dropped his survival knife and stabbed yourself in the top of the foot when we first got in country were you?
Larry Kwiatkowski (Scooter) <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, Ca USA - Friday, February 14, 2003 at 20:22:46 (MST)
Hi Ya Hobie, man it was quite a sight that day when I was behind you. There was so much coming out of your bird that we got a little gassed behind you. Happy to see you're still with us.
Larry Kwiatkowski (Scooter) <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, CA USA - Friday, February 14, 2003 at 20:19:32 (MST)
....Ok Fred.
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Friday, February 14, 2003 at 16:03:25 (MST)
Mark.....There are not going to be any newspaper article about me....that newspaper broke the "printer`s union" back in the early 80`s. A bunch of Nam vet`s lost their job`s and some never recovered. Plus when we were fighting hiring practices by The State of Ohio and City of Columbus, they didn`t want to hire Viet-Nam vets and give the "priority hiring". The Columbus Dispatch wrote a rotten article about Viet-Nam vets. And endorsed what the State and City government was doing. Bottom line, we won a class action law suit and forced them to hire Viet-Nam vets. Police and Fire unions also follow suit, and won theirs. Federal Judge also ruled that a Vet gets 10 bonus points on any test taken. Columbus is a one newspaper town, everything is reported from a "extreme right" point of view. They own a TV and Radio station also. What they want is a "point of view" story about the impending war, from a Viet-Nam vets perspective. They`ll have to find some other poor soul. They probably thought I mellowed over the years. They just want a "talking head" that shares their "point of view". NO Mark....there won`t be any articles.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Friday, February 14, 2003 at 13:33:54 (MST)
....Mr Jim Jobe......awesome story and what a wonderful thing to see happen in the 129th Flight LOg Book. Reassures me that this sight is worth it all....Freddie Boy???...have all the stories been put back in the Flight Log Book that you spoke of?.......Hope so, because I enjoyed all of them also.........and so Freddie, ya might make the newspaper also.....cool man.....ya all take care....home for the afternoon, Dee and I are pullin' the night shift at the Pop-A-Top tonight. ..........Happy Valentines day to you all..always a brother..........Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Friday, February 14, 2003 at 12:32:06 (MST)
max, i went, i looked.Very nice and very origianal.
USA - Friday, February 14, 2003 at 06:55:32 (MST)
Mr.Jobe....SIR...Proud to see you sign on for you comments. Hobie.... a man of my 129th experience....does my heart good.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 19:11:40 (MST)
Jim Jobe: Great story! (We didn't have gas-masks back in 66-67, that I recall. Or if we did, we didn't carry them.)
Max Whittington
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 17:57:01 (MST)
Ooops. Quilt is at: http://www.bettyblais.com/protect_defend.html
Max Whittington
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 17:49:47 (MST)
Something a little different: My sister is an award winning quilter. She just finished a quilt entitled "Protect, Defend, and Serve." It incorporates photo-transferred material with pics of all my kin-folk who've served in the U.S. armed forces since the first did, during the Civil War. It's at . For closeups, go to the bottom of the page and click on the marked link.
Max Whittington <Max@OregonPI.com>
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 17:47:54 (MST)
Greetings, 129th… I don’t write very much in this forum, but I saw the traffic regarding my CS gas ”incident” of ’70 and wanted to add something for the record. Remembering back I’d like to finally thank two people whom I actually credit for saving my life and those of the crew on that day. Rene Morrell; You may not remember Rene, but we were told to test our gasmasks in a CS filled tent a month or so prior to this mission. I wasn’t going to test mine because I had a very unpleasant experience in basic training with CS gas…and was of course sure that mine didn’t need testing and that it worked. Rene thought that this was not a good idea and that he would test my mask for me and off he went to the tent…well, the mask (filter canister) didn’t work and he got face full of the stuff…he took that bullet for me. Of course there were no extra canisters in supply so my mask was useless. Jeff Sauers; On the day of the mission I was headed out the door and “Snapper” stopped me in the hallway of our hooch and asked what the mission was. When I told him a CS mission, he asked if I had a gasmask. I told him mine didn’t work and I was going without one. He immediately grabbed his gasmask and forced it into my hands. I said “no thanks” and tried to give it back but he wouldn’t take “no” for an answer…so I took it. An hour later sitting in the cockpit I thought that since I had a gasmask I might as well wear it…it turned out to be a good thing. My point is, had I not known my gasmask didn’t work, I would have taken it and worn it and the mask would have failed. Had it not been for “Snapper” recognizing I didn’t have a mask and insisting I take his, I don’t think the crew would be here today. That gasmask beat 50 lbs of exploding CS gas …I truly believe it saved our lives. Gentlemen, on behalf of Joel, Pete, Curt and me, please accept my Thanks. Jim Jobe, “Hobie”
James Jobe <pavelowrider@networld.com>
Ogden, UT USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 16:23:52 (MST)
Fred Alvis....The Columbus Dispatch is a ultra-conservative newspaper, so they probably don`t want to hear what I got say. Ronnie Bianco is a good guy, and does good work, but what he wants to write about....I`m sure he can find another Nam Vet to give a "positive spin" on the subject. I`ve dealt with the Dispatch on "other matters" before. Marky Mark, I sent the webmaster Dave a e-mail last night. He sent a nice e-mail back thanking me for bringing that to his attention, the stories disappearing.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 13:09:04 (MST)
....The webmaster has found and restored the stories about the missions you have been telling in here.....God Bless the WEbmaster;-)))..he is good.....take care brother...always a brother..mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 11:13:28 (MST)
Don Miller,good job .Well done. Hey Fred S... if you get written up,let us know the newspaper site. I would be intrested in reading it. Hey gentle gently,when is next kokomo reunion? i need to request time off b4 end of this month. hope i dont get fired, but "Lowes home improvement" vacation policy sucks.They give you 2 weeks, but will not let you take 2 weeks in a row off.( with out special consideration). Was thinking of driving to yellowstone, stopping bye smitty's place.Not enough time in one week.so, my eyes turn toward Alanta.Smile, was first town i was ever thrown in jail in.18 years old, beer and fire works,facing vietnam...is funny now.cost me 70 bucks in fines, if i remember correctly, more than a weeks pay. I hate the Snow. go away,come on daffadills.
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 10:25:57 (MST)
Well worth a visit Liana
Athens Hotels <submit@gtahotels.com>
LA, CA USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 08:21:28 (MST)
Amazing....Angie and I worked together on "union/management" committee things, such as child care benefits for city workers, amongst other things. The child care benefit was Angie and I`s "brainchild". I worked for Parks and Recreation, and had noticed over the years that the public would drop off their children at rec centers at 8:00am and would pick them up at 6:00pm anyway....free child care. So Angie and I came up with the idea and it worked out very well. Charge a small fee for insurance to cover the kids and the rec leaders were paid by the city. Cheap child care. The women were amazed that a man could come with a idea like that. Yea...Viet-Nam was never a topic of conversation with people I didn`t know to well. I had told Angie about this web site a few weeks ago. Hope you guys don`t mind.....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 07:55:55 (MST)
Shaking Freds hand in congrats. I wonder,if now, there will be an influx of people into this site,and if so, lets hope it reaches more 129th folks,or those vets that need an ear.
USA - Thursday, February 13, 2003 at 06:02:59 (MST)
My name is Angela Bianco, I am a evironmental scientist with the City of Columbus,Ohio. I had the pleasure of working with Fred Skaggs during his 25 year tenure with the city. My brother Ron Bianco is a columnist with the Columbus Dispatch newspaper. We wanted to see some of the stories that Fred had made reference to on this web-site. Ron wanted to do a article on Fred for the local newspaper. Most of us hardly knew he was a Viet-Nam Vet. We truly miss him at the city. Thank You Men for serving our country so well. You truly deserve more credit that you received. God Bless You All
Angela Bianco-Grice <ana@smoc.cmhmetro.net>
Columbus, OH USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 23:32:00 (MST)
Flight, well my new page has met the approval of my chosen critic. so if you click on my name below it will take you to it. the only problem I have now is I only have 4 pictures posted, I need 32 more. so please if you have any picture of the guys, send me a .jpg or .gif or whatever you have (.jpg & .gif download faster) I can change it to the format I need after I get it. this one has a better background so it is easier to read. thanks I really need the help whith the pictures. Later, Don (but still not fred LOL)
Don Miller <hogleg244@yahoo.com>
Valley Farms, AZ USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 11:51:17 (MST)
I guess there would be nothing wrong with me being Fred .. except I might get mixed up with my brother-in-law ......... wait what's wrong with that ? he owns 2 Harleys and I drive a VW kit car hhmmmmm LOL
Don Miller <hogleg244@yahoo.com>
Valley Farms, AZ USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 11:36:50 (MST)
“She looked at me and said,"Everybody got rich during the war, and you guys fighting it got nothing".” Fred, you have one very smart lady there. She figured out in one sentence what most are still scratching their heads over. And they wonder why some of us have serious reservations about the current debacle.
Tom Shanahan
USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 08:58:12 (MST)
Don Miller....What`s wrong with being Fred?.....LOL......Poor ole Fred......LOL
Fred Skaggs
USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 07:37:29 (MST)
Mark...There was a bunch of stories we all were telling lately....Kim started reading them because 129th is my "home page". She said reading the stories was better than the National Enquirer or Star magazines. The stuff is all true!!!! She said, she couldn`t find them in the archives. She enjoyed the Mang Yang Pass stories about Mobile Group 100. She got on the internet and found the full story of the battle, blow by blow. Also gave her a lot of insight on the Viet-Nam war and the arrogant French culture. Like she ask me," How come the French is always getting their ass kicked". She found out thru her research, that we were fighting the war, and Michlen rubber was doing "business as usual". She looked at me and said,"Everybody got rich during the war, and you guys fighting it got nothing". Kim was only 8 years old when I came home from Nam!!!! She just turned 40 a few months back. So that`s why I ask about the stories.....Where`s the beef? I`ll call you later today, Mark.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 07:28:33 (MST)
Mark, I'm not Fred but I can't find anything written from Nov,2002 till Feb 6 2003. all the stories that were here are gone. Later Don Miller Mar 69-70
Don Miller
USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 07:15:31 (MST)
......Fred????.....what commo you talkin' bout???........Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Wednesday, February 12, 2003 at 05:50:42 (MST)
J.W.Wilson..... Man if your serious....we`d love to . My wife loves Wilmington, we would move down there...if it wasn`t for the 2 hour commute to Raleigh. Send me a e-mail and we`ll talk. MARK....what did you do with all that commo that was going. YOU don`t have that stuff on a CD somewhere do you?..... LOL.....writing that book you were talkin about? My wife Kim was the one who noticed it was gone..... she reads them stories....I never talked about Nam with her that much. Better not sell that script to Hollywood. Don`t put me out of the loop. Maybe some of the other brothers would like to have some input to THAT BOOK.....LOL
Fred Skaggs <ac459429@earthlink.net>
USA - Tuesday, February 11, 2003 at 23:02:05 (MST)
Hi Fred,I saw your message a few days ago.I go to Wilmington about every other month for weekend. i would like to take you and your wife out to "Someting Fishy" while I am down there.
J.W. Wilson <Kas3 ncfredom.net>
USA - Tuesday, February 11, 2003 at 20:18:36 (MST)
Scooter....Matt was Cups "Main Man", they flew together probably 7 or 8 months. Matt had sent me a e-mail saying he was moving back to California. Him and I hung out together in Nam. Great to hear he`s home...
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 11, 2003 at 05:58:44 (MST)
Had a REAL good evening. Matt Casey showed up at my place 2nite. 1st time I've seen him since 'Nam. He was a CE in '70. He crewed for me a few times. Real good guy, had a lot of fun hovering down the memory taxiway. Cups would probably remember him. "Scooter"
Larry Kwiatkowski <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, CA USA - Tuesday, February 11, 2003 at 00:09:09 (MST)
Larry, Really liked the helcopter game! Just about my speed these days. Sent the address on to some others.
Tom Shanahan
Phoenix, AZ USA - Monday, February 10, 2003 at 17:42:00 (MST)
Hey Fred. I wuz there in the 129th from Dec. 69-Dec.70. I'm not sure anymore exactly what set it off. It might have been one of the Koreans on board. Caught his boot in a lanyard and pulled it loose and it went off. If I remember right, the altimiters on the canisters weren't set 'till we got up in the air. When he snagged that one it probably wasn't set for a lower altitude yet. GAs masks weren't standard in the birds, we only got 'em if we were gonna do a CS gas drop. Anybody look at that copter game yet? It's kind of addicting. Scooter
Larry Kwiatkowski <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, CA USA - Monday, February 10, 2003 at 16:55:27 (MST)
Larry, You mean gas masks actually inside the helicopters? When did the unit get all fancied up? I'm laughing as I think about it. A particular situation towards the north end of the Phu Cat's in early 68 brings it back to mind. Medevac had been called to pull a wounded Korean civilian (reporter, KCIA, who knows?) off a hillside where the bad guys were dug in pretty deep and the good guys were trying to dig them out. Copious quantities of CS powder had been dumped upon the landscape. Medevac declined the invitation so a not too bright gun pilot said, heck, we'll do that. Ummmm, no gas masks on board. No problem. Everybody just take a deep breath and close your eyes until the not too bright AC gets us into the pickup LZ where we can't land because of the stumps, rocks, trees, bad guys, powdered CS, inability to see. Into a hover, open those eyes, grab that wounded guy and pull him up and in, can't go out forward, can't see, take off backwards, pedal turn and fall off the mountain, sure, that's the ticket. Stumbled into the rice paddy on the flat, gave the guy with a big hole in his shoulder to the medevac bird........ While I have never had the opportunity to apologize for incredible foolishness to those involved, I do so now should they be reading here. And with continuing thanks to a Forgiving and Protective Higher Power. Soothsayer, 67-68
Tom Shanahan
Phoenix, AZ USA - Monday, February 10, 2003 at 16:10:18 (MST)
Goodevening Flight: First would like to say Welcome Home to our New Brothers that have found the site. Been trying to catch up on the flight log. Max did Cline's info do you any good?? I haven't heard back from Rich Schwabedissen. Hope he can make Atlanta. Also sent Cline a letter and application to the VHCMA. He was a member at one time. Ray, was good talking to you. Have patience with the VA. and hopefully someting will get going for you. Looking forward to seeing you in Atlanta. I am going to get the tv stations involved about one of our Vietnam Brothers whom had a stroke almost 2 years ago. The VA refuses to give him 100%. He is down to 112lbs can't walk and needs constant supervision. Putting a huge strain on his wife and family. Our tv stations are good about getting througj the red tape. I pray they can this time. We visited with him in Mississippi last weekend. The reunion in Atlanta is one of the things that keeps him fighting. I told his wife if anyway possible we will get Tommy there!! Well hope to see all of you in Atlanta!! As I said in the past. Whether you were crew or 394th,pol or whatever, we all work together as a team to make the 129th the unit it was. Alex
Alex Fernwalt <afernwal@midsouth.com>
Memphis, TN. USA - Monday, February 10, 2003 at 16:07:36 (MST)
Scooter, my friend,...Do you recall what cause that cannister to blow up? I was flying that day with Bill Pecknold( the older Pecknold) AC Steve( Peabody)Young and Bob (Spud)Weaver PP somewhere else, I just can`t recall. Brother Ray.....I think I was coming in as you were going. I got to Nam 5 January, 1970, but I was down at Phu Hiep for my first two months. I didn`t get to the 129th until 5 March, 1970. How are you feelin these days?
Fred Skaggs
USA - Monday, February 10, 2003 at 15:35:01 (MST)
Fred, I wuz flying right behind Hobie when that cannister went off Man, we were shitting a brick when we saw that. He wuz flying that thing sideways tryin to blow the gas out. Aside from the burns, those gys were damned lucky it didn't get any worse. During the loading process, remember when one of the Koreans dropped a cannister and it went off? It gassed most of us cause the damned cs cloud went right down the line of ships and most of us had left our gas masks in the birds. Oh, by the way, I'm gonna post a web site where there's a heicopter game. It's not as easy as it looks. hehhe http://www.hurtwood.demon.co.uk/Fun/copter.swf C y'all later. Scooter.
Larry Kwiatkowski <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, CA USA - Monday, February 10, 2003 at 13:57:06 (MST)
STREET, MD USA - Monday, February 10, 2003 at 13:11:22 (MST)
Max....When I was there in 1970, 664 with Curt Frank as crewchief and Pete Rhome as the gunner, AC was Jim (Hobie) Jobe and the PP was Joey Priebe, had a cannister go off inside the helicopter. It wasn`t a laughing matter. It was all Hobie could do to get that ship down. They all got burnt bad enough that the skin was peeling off the back of Hobie`s and Joey`s necks. Curt and Pete stood outside on the skids so they get their breath. At one point Pete almost jumped, not knowing he was still 2,000 feet in the air. It just happen to clear up so he could see where they were at. Amazingly Hobie got it down. I can`t remember how it happen, just the aftermath.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 09, 2003 at 17:58:06 (MST)
Hi Gang!!! Lee Wood.. Good to see you post!! Glad to hear you are going to Atlanta. Will be lookin for you. Ted, yes that 901 of lee's was a pretty strack ship. Always a pleasure to fly. I hope yopu are planning on Atlanta too.. Mark, my email on email.com has been messed up for the past week. I am going to start using Yahoo so try me there please. I was looking forward to your response on riding down together. I sure am getting the itch.. Gale, hows the job going? Hope you are getting plenty of bucks stored up for the trip to Atlanta!!.. Did you get the shed done?? Looks like a clod week ahead up here and when spring breaks I hope it stays nice. Too cold too long!! Take care flight and "think spring!!" OH yea, Max, your experience with the gas was interesting and it sounded like you were luck to have come out of it as good as you did!!..Lots of hairy little situations.. Lots of good como lately.. C U L8r... Kal...>>>
Kal Bergstrom <n8auu@yahoo.com>
Saint Joseph, MI USA - Sunday, February 09, 2003 at 17:40:10 (MST)
All this talk about chemical/biological agents has me squirming in my skin. I can only imagine how it would be to fight in a chem-suit, especially in the heat. It also reminds me of one incident: The grunts were blowing CS powder through some tunnels with explosives. Just as we lifted off, they set off a charge, and powder came blowing out through a previously undetected hole in some bushes right beside our ship. It blew directly in through my doorway, and we were all almost instantly gassed and blinded. The pilot (I believe either Lt. Dodge or Lt. Wallace) had already picked us up off the ground a ways, and elected to take us straight up (luckily, we were empty at the time). We managed to clear everything, but it was dicey for awhile, and the language got a bit rough!
Max Whittington <Max@Oregonpi.com>
USA - Sunday, February 09, 2003 at 15:07:40 (MST)
David did you get my pics I sent my before and after pics in. This will be great in reconizing for the reunion. Flight be careful out there.
Rick England
USA - Sunday, February 09, 2003 at 10:11:43 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
- Observer Post Removed -
,,,evenin' Flight.....so good to be here with you.....man oh man oh man.......so much interesting talk going on in here..........keep it up.....I just updated my persanal contacts list and we have 234 on board the flight......absolutly wonderful....wouldnt it be great if all of them could be together in one reuion at the same time......gezzzz...we would have to rent a whole hotel....but boy what a weekend......hey I talked to the webmaster about the BR FORE AND AFTER picture page for the 129th sight.... He said was a go, so if you want to, instead of sending them to me, just send them to his address which is......................carbon@fuse.net......His name is David........soon to be a daddy actually............hope this finds all well......still cold here. Snows bout every day .....and the Harley is just settin' there doing nuttin'.....Hey Tom Marr.....your e-mail I sent you came back. Ya got a new addy???....and Kal Bergstrom, yours did too...Hum.......and to all the rest, If you do every move or change e-mail address, and want to stay active in the 129th please forward it to me, or send it to David at the above addy and he will make the change......Lee Wood, good to see ya here....Animal???..you got an e-mail addy you would like posted???.if not, that fine also.........take care my brothers and sisters.......keep the chatter up and lets see if we can have the largest number of the 129th down in Atlanta.........always a brother............Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@brighyt.net>
- Saturday, February 08, 2003 at 20:30:58 (MST)
Lee wood, good to hear from you, you must've got arthritis from all the waxing you did on "Tiger Wagon". Ship stood tall.
Ted Buisker <Skyking@stateline-isp.com>
Davis, IL. USA - Saturday, February 08, 2003 at 07:42:25 (MST)
Juniorszone-providers of online primary school education offering literacy,numeracy keystage2 strategy based on national curriculum,uk.
Rajinder Gill <juniorszone@yahoo.co.uk>
Ludhiana, Punjab India - Saturday, February 08, 2003 at 06:58:08 (MST)
welcome to the 129th a.o. leonard
USA - Saturday, February 08, 2003 at 06:05:21 (MST)
Welcome home Leonard. I was there in 68 also. CE 431. Hey Lee good to hear from you. I hear that all of ships flying over the south from 101st. Starting to get spam even here.
Rick England
USA - Saturday, February 08, 2003 at 05:07:05 (MST)
HOUSTON, TX USA - Friday, February 07, 2003 at 21:49:38 (MST)
Hi Ted, Just read your recall of flying with General Chung in Tiger Wagon. That was my ship. Crewed Tiger Wagon 901 for the General. Spent a lot of time with the old grease gun, not much free time. Hope to see you in Atlanta. Lee Wood, Sept. 67,Aug. 68.
Lee Wood <CWood86700@aol.com>
USA - Friday, February 07, 2003 at 21:01:20 (MST)
GREAT SITE. I was surfing the net and ran across this site. Great articles and great photo gallery. Thanks to all you for defending our great country. - jeff
Jeff Jennings <webmaster@fastboats.info>
Rising Sun, MD USA - Friday, February 07, 2003 at 20:09:52 (MST)
Flight...I was watching CNN today and they were talking about the 101st Airborne. Now they said that the 101st is the ONLY Air Assault unit in the Army. What happen to the 1st Cav ? Is Airmoble different than Air Assault. And I thought there were more units than the Air Cav and 101st Airborne, as far as Air Mobile or Air Assault. What happen to the 7/17 Cav? Were they absorbed by other units. And does the 1st Aviation Division exist? I don`t stay up on the new military stuff very much.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Friday, February 07, 2003 at 16:06:08 (MST)
hi, does any one remember Charlie High, a pilot with the 48th in 65 and 66, his wife of 41 years died this week.
J.W. Wilson <kas3@ncfredom.net>
USA - Friday, February 07, 2003 at 13:56:48 (MST)
The 101st Airborne is moving out with all the Helicopters. check it out http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/020703/met_11686079.shtml
Rick England
USA - Friday, February 07, 2003 at 05:56:52 (MST)
Terry, saw your posting, Welcome Home and Welcome to the greatest little web site in the world. Robbie 69/70 2nd PLT.
Rochester, NY USA - Friday, February 07, 2003 at 05:40:14 (MST)
Terry...welcome home!! You guys might have to start a "Pop A Top II" out there in Az. ;O) Gale Beard May 67- May 68
Gale Beard
Clinton, In USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 20:16:55 (MST)
Welcome back.
j.w. wilson <kas3@ncfredom.net>
USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 17:32:53 (MST)
Hi Terry, glad to see you here. GROUP: Does anyone know how to get "after-action" reports, and how long it takes? If so, please email me the info, or post here.
Max Whittington <Max@OregonPI.com>
USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 13:42:51 (MST)
This is a good one just passing along from someone else.**************** > IN COURT: > > Defense Attorney: What is your age? > Little Old Woman: I am 86 years old. > > Defense Attorney: Will you tell us, in your own words, what happened to > > you? > Little Old Woman: There I was, sitting there in my swing on my front > porch on a warm spring evening, when a young man comes creeping up on > the porch and sat down beside me. > > Defense Attorney: Did you know him? > Little Old Woman: No, but he sure was friendly. > > Defense Attorney: What happened after he sat down? > Little Old Woman: He started to rub my thigh. > > Defense Attorney: Did you stop him? > Little Old Woman: No, I didn't stop him. > > Defense Attorney: Why not? > Little Old Woman: It felt good. Nobody had done that since my Abner > passed away some 30 years ago. > > Defense Attorney: What happened next? > Little Old Woman: He began to rub my breasts.. > > Defense Attorney: Did you stop him then? > Little Old Woman: No, I did not stop him. > > Defense Attorney: Why not? > Little Old Woman: Why, Your Honor, his rubbing made me feel all alive > and excited. I haven't felt that good in years! > > Defense Attorney: What happened next? > Little Old Woman: Well, I was feeling so spicy that I just spread my > old > legs and said to him......"Take me.... young man... Take me!" > > Defense Attorney: Did he take you? > Little Old Woman: Hell, no. He just yelled, "April Fool!!"... And > that's > when I shot the son of a bitch!
Rick England
USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 09:22:20 (MST)
Welcome Home Terry. Another AZ. Boy We need to have a mini reunion out here. Terry I left in 1/69 also in 1st flt. plt. What ship were you on? Bill Whelan and I had the same cubicle.
Rick England <bd431@mindspring.com>
Wittmann, Az USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 08:35:48 (MST)
welcome back to the 129th a.o. terry. Ray Granger.....your with family here.Hang in there buddy.
USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 08:11:06 (MST)
Terry, Hello neighbor WELCOME HOME and welcome back to the 129th AHC
Don Miller <hogleg244@yahoo.com>
Valley Farms, AZ USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 06:25:30 (MST)
Was in the 129th from 1/68 to 1/69, 1st flt plt.
Terry Strong <TCSMMS@aol.com>
Higley, AZ USA - Thursday, February 06, 2003 at 03:44:29 (MST)
Brother Freddie.....one story I'll always remember is one -------------used a few times...most major leaguer's can lay claim to being all this or all that while coming up through the ranks..I wasn't even the best player on my block!!!!! He grew up in the neighborhood with Yogi!!
USA - Wednesday, February 05, 2003 at 15:19:26 (MST)
No way I can laugh at that, Fred! I managed to shoot up my own windscreen one day, shooting forward. Picked out a target around my ten oclock, and stayed with it through a left turn, till I lost sight of under the nose of the ship. Three neat little holes in the screen, about door handle high! Mike Lovejoy, our Soothsayer (71) was the peter pilot. The 2.75 was ww2 technology, sometimes they went where they were supposed to...sometimes they didn't! Mike spent part of a day trying to hit a hootch, one rocket at a time, till the fac got sick of waiting, and put a wp into it himself. Another time, Tom Roy,(Regent) put one into the back of a cave while yawing us to the left at about 70 knots!....I was always amazed at how some of the p-pilots had a hard time hovering the thing in one country, and when one of the older guys would finally say....sigh...I got it, the thing would turn into a ROCK. Hovering is easy????
Kim La Voie
USA - Wednesday, February 05, 2003 at 15:13:24 (MST)
Kim. sorry, am not sure where c,a. was.I remember,scrub brush, grassy and bare hills.Smoke and fires burning everywhere,loked like a vison of dante's hell.Smile. i remember it was in that time frame cause...dont you guys laugh. Several times i was leaning out ,firing m-60 forward,into corps of trees, ravine edges where large brush was...anywhere someone could have good cover. Anyway,several time when i was shotting,the place i was shooting at would blow up.Thinking i had secondaries,i reported it to the pilots.I had aslo ben hearing strange nosies,and upon hearing agin, i turned to look behind us.The noises were coming from rockets being fired by b model guns closely following us. The pilots were putting rockets right where i was shooting each time.Was very embarresing at the time, but i still remember thing that who ever those pilots were,they were excellent shots.The place looked like what 'D-Day must have looked like.Was total assult by many units,all going hot, guns blowing up everything in sight,grass fires,trees on fire,billowing smoke coloums, choppers everywhere. Was the biggest action i saw there,it truely could not have been copied in a hollywood rendition. speaking of rotor strikes, when i was with 60th ach,i was flying in c and c ship.saw o bird land to extract korean troops. Big problem was...they were up hill from the bird. As they ran down the steep hill,they ran into the rotors,causing the bird to crash also.We had to go down to the site and fly wounded servivors back to where ever.I wonder just how many we lost due to simple, but tragic, mistakes of that nature.never mind, I dont want to now.best kept sleeping.
USA - Wednesday, February 05, 2003 at 06:36:02 (MST)
- Observer Post Removed -
The warhead on a flechette rocket armed under acceleration. When it stopped accelerating a small charge with dye fired and pushed the flechettes out of the warhead and they started to disperse. If I recall at 1500 meter slant range they would put one flechette per square foot in the area of a football field.
Gus <tgus@uslink.net>
Grand Rapids, MN USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 22:23:48 (MST)
Ted Ý Possibly guilty as charged although I think it had more to do with the fact that if you put enough rockets downrange, you are bound to hit something eventually Ý or thread a needle as the case may be. :) The secret with rockets from a “B” model was using the cat whisker antenna for a sight. The top two inches of the antenna was painted white as I remember. Put the base of the white on the target and fire. Advanced optical sighting device. Don’t think the flechette rockets had proximity fuses. The flechette rockets expanded out in something called a “pink cloud” a couple hundred meters out of the tube then a couple thousands nails (flechettes) deployed to the target area. Not supposed to be used within a klick of friendlies. Real ugly weapon. The proximity fuses were on the heads of the 17 pound 2.75” warheads and were supposed to blow them 10 meters off the ground. Sometimes they actually worked. Hope we never have to use any of this stuff in anger again. Any chance you could get those slides posted on the site? And who were the other Soothsayers in the 129th? Soothsayer 67-68
Tom Shanahan <Shanahan00@Cox.net>
Phoenix, AZ USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 21:48:51 (MST)
You got to be kidding!!!!! Deja Vu......Crosby,Stills,Nash and Young album 1970....We have all been there before.....Monsieur LaVoie, Pouvez-vous m'aider s'il vous plait? Je vous en prie. Yogi Berra is a Yankee....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 20:04:50 (MST)
Fred Alvis, you mentioned a big CA back in September, 71??/ I think it was just north of Phu Cat, rice paddy country. I know we flew cover on a big ca up there, just like you described..the first few lifts were something else! Going in right alongside the lead elements, pilots pointing out targets for us to blast at the north end of the paddies, low scrub brush, a small hollow with a creek in it. Sound familiar??
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 19:07:16 (MST)
Just some dude who played for Ohio State
Kim La Voie
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 18:59:48 (MST)
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 17:52:34 (MST)
WOW...Flight....Like Yogi Berra once said, " Looks like Deja Vu all over again"!!!!!
Fred Skaggs <ac459429@earthlink.net>
Raleigh, NC USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 17:04:13 (MST)
JW Wilson, I checked www.vhfcn.com and the 48th, 117th and 180th all have unit web sites. Scroll down the site and click on "helicopter units" Rene, got your E-mail and replied but it came back. Know how to fix it as soon as I have time.
AT WORK, VAMC SALISBURY, USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 16:48:05 (MST)
Hi Don, Thanks for the information.
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 16:28:46 (MST)
That was late 68 early 69. Fat fingered the keyboard AGAIN. I also remember we where covering a dustoff one time. They started to take the ROK out on the winch and took fire. Pulled up with him on the hook and ended up taking him for a ride out over the water. They had to set down on the beach with him still on the cable. He was a bit wet but got to his feet. Talk about having a bad day!
Gus <tgus@uslink.net>
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 11:38:55 (MST)
Anyone know who was the AC and PP that pulled the SEAL team with dog off the beach one night south of the Phu Cats? The ship was 949 and I was the CE. It would have been late 67 early 67. One night I will always remember. I wish I had taken the time then to get to know you guy better. Just wanted to do the job and get home alive and with all the parts I came with.
Gus <tgus@usling.net>
Grand Rapids, MN USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 11:29:14 (MST)
Tom Shanahan, the old Soothsayer. Were you the one that we always said could thread a needle with a pair of rockets? I remember two incidents south of the Phu Cats, one where you or somebody cut a tree out of the way of the slicks, so we had more room for ships on a CA. Another time using the Flechette rockets with the bad proximity fuses that wouldn't burst at ten feet like they were supposed to, but had to make contact to blow. Nailed that VC machine gunner right to a tree. We off loaded troops right there, and I still remember that belt buckle with the yellow star on it hanging there. Hell, he must've been a regular NVA, weren't many of them around our AO. I remember the cemetery deal too, but I don't think I was on that flare mission. I still have some slides of a big weapons cache they found on the south slopes of the Phu Cats, Had a chi-com 51 cal there, to think that thing might have had us in the sights was chilling. I have some slides of VERY close cover on a one ship insertion too. Can see the dust kicked up by the guns, and smoke from the rockets. Wow, the memories that come back with just a little trigger.
Ted Buisker <Skyking@stateline-isp.com>
Davis, IL. USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 11:02:30 (MST)
Night missions...I have to put in my little two cents....We did a Flare mission that was up highway 19 just before An Khe pass, north into a little valley village attached to a 22nd ARVN compound. Now just happens it was a medivac call to that compound, no gun support needed. Now the medic from the 498th Dust-Off, was Wally Sousa from Heyward,California. Him and I were close friends and he was on the mission also. Wally had been a field medic with the the 5th Special Forces up when Duc Co had been a Special Forces camp. He could speak the language fluently and once explain to me the the native langauge didn`t contain enough verbs and nouns in order for a english speaker to make a point in print. Such as instructions how to tear down weapons and clean them and so forth. They just didn`t have a big enough volcabulary to support all the english words needed. Wally was a " pot smoker" and had been kicked out of the special forces. But as we approached our drop off point for the flares, the medivac went in to pick-up a wounded soldier or something. But I thought also "we don`t need any gun support so this is not a "hot mission". After everything was done and the pick-up was successful, the medivac radioed he would be going to Bagi for the drop-off. Bagi was the 22nd ARVN Division Headquarters, and I thought that was strange. But we headed back to Lane and shut down. Not long after that I could see Wally`s ship come in and so I went over to Dust-Off to meet him. Wally was upset about the mission....The mission: A MAVC advisor had called us out so he could impress a high ranking ARVN officer with taking the ARVN officer`s pregnant wife to Bagi for delivery of a baby. But she had went into labor on the way there and Wally had to deliver that baby on the helicopter. All that because a arrogant MACV Major wanted to show his power. Wally and I stayed in touch over the years, long before computers and e-mail. Wally and I met in Albuquerque,New Mexico in 1995 and attended the NCAA Basketball Regional Finals there. But we laugh about that chapter of Viet-Nam, Wally said," That momma san probably had a HMO and her doctor was at Bagi".......
Fred Skaggs
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 08:28:34 (MST)
http://www.rotors.org/ interesting site with classic rotors.
Rick England
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 07:54:44 (MST)
I just got this this morning thought you might like it. Subject: Can you believe this... A sign at a business establishment in Philadelphia, PA: "WE WOULD RATHER DO BUSINESS WITH 1000 AL QAEDA TERRORISTS THAN WITH A SINGLE AMERICAN" This sign was prominently displayed in the window of a business in Philadelphia. You are probably outraged at the thought of such an inflammatory statement. One would think that anti-hate groups from all across the country would be marching on this business... And that the National Guard might have to be called to keep the angry crowds back. But, perhaps in these stressful times one might be tempted to let the proprietors simply make their statement . . . We are a society who holds Freedom of Speech as perhaps our greatest liberty . . . And after all, it is just a sign. You may ask what kind of business would dare post such a sign? Answer: A Funeral Home (Who said morticians didn't have a sense of humor?)
Don Miller <hogleg244@yahoo.com>
Valley Farms , AZ USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 06:34:32 (MST)
I remember the spray ship in 1st platoon the od green paint was gone off the tail boom downto the zinc chormate that lime green color. I hope that CE is doing ok. Bill Roddis took that ship an it got painted he called it the flintstone flyer. I hope that CE is doing ok.We helped him load the barrels in the morning. He had blonde hair then. ***********I hear Sadam's head body guard defected and told where the missles and bio weapons are stored is that true? Has anybody heard?
Rick England
USA - Tuesday, February 04, 2003 at 05:36:04 (MST)
Ted -- Those flare missions. Loved the light; hated the thought of those flares and canisters and chutes coming down through our rotors as we flew gun missions while you provided the light show. Remembering those flare missions on the flats north of QuiNhon up towards the Phu Cat Mountains. I think those flares burned down more villages than we did with the gun ships some nights. Can still see it sometimes. Mark 24's, million-candle power if memory serves. Could read a newspaper by the light. That mission just east of Highway 1, Americans pinned in the cemetery to the west of that village. The flares were so bright that we could see the bad guys swimming across the canal to the cemetery. They didn't make it to the cemetery. That was a time when I learned just a bit about the terror of a gun ship, even an old "B" model, from the point of view of the guy on the ground. I could hear our rockets going over his head over his radio. And he kept asking if we could bring them closer!! Hell of a night. One of those missions where we were supposed to get permission to fire from the village chief, the province chief, the Vietnamese advisor, the Korean advisor, the MACV advisor - Mother May I PLEASE Shoot these folks what are trying to kill us kind of nights - you remember those. Major "G", Operations Officer extraordinaire, uh huh, uh huh. Captain Groover when I got there. Two tours back to back. Got him the promotion. He got a DFC for a mission down south, too. Beloved of all, uh huh, uh huh. As I remember the resulting wreck on that night CA after the rotor blades kissed and didn't make up was on a hillside also. Or was that the other time he wrecked one up in the Phu Cat's. There were so many - hard to remember. The spray rigs for Agent Orange on the 129th birds were just after my time but I do remember flying behind and under C-123's spraying the QhiNhon Pass. We were providing gun cover for the Air Force. We were told it was a mix of diesel fuel and JP4. Not to worry about it. If it was so safe, why did they feel the need to lie about it so consistently? Couple days later it looked like a moonscape through the pass. Everything was dead and black. And yes, one day in country is Prima facia evidence of exposure to Agent Orange. Cobra Soothsayer, 67-68
Tom Shanahan <Shanahan00@Cox.net>
Phoenix, AZ USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 22:29:03 (MST)
The VA acknowledges exposure for having been in Vietnam. However, to be compensated you must file and demonstrate that you have one or more of the recognized disabilities that exposure can cause. For detaileed information on this go to www.VVA.org. They have alot of info on going through the VA claim procedure for compensation.
Fred Brown <FJBuffalo@Yahoo.com>
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 21:27:29 (MST)
J.W. trylooking at:http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/2669/0001abdmc.html#17th I saw a 10th Bn there but I didn't look around long enough to see if the others were there. Later, Don
Don Miller <hogleg244@yahoo.com>
Valley Farms, AZ USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 19:32:40 (MST)
hi, does the 48, 117, 180 or 10th bn have a posting like this one. j.w. 129 66-67
j.w. wilson <Kas3@ncfredom.net>
kinston, nc USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 19:15:36 (MST)
STREET, MD USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 18:51:25 (MST)
Just saw my IL Dept. of Veterans Affairs service officer today, and reconfirmed that if you have any "time in country", no matter what branch of the service, you have "assumed" Agent Orange exposure. His name is David Groves, and he is in the Freeport, IL. office. Saw no paper work, just his word, and he's an old chopper pilot too, so his word should be "Good as Gold". LOL yeah right.
Ted Buisker <Skyking@stateline-isp.com>
Davis, IL. USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 18:51:09 (MST)
STREET , MD USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 17:52:38 (MST)
http://heli-vet-pictures.vetspot.com/ This is an example of the before and after pics.
Rick England
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 17:43:27 (MST)
....WOW guys....your stories of Night Missions and Close Formations are amazing to read. I know that you guys can see it all again in your minds eye, but , in at the same time, you make my minds eye see also............thanks a lot.........great stuff.......Frenchie.....am trying to do something about the Then and now page you suggested......good idea.....want to see if we can just send the photos straight to the webmaster instead of me haveing to forward them to him.........I let ya'all know... .......always a brother.........Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 17:37:46 (MST)
STREET , MD USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 15:32:06 (MST)
STREET, MD USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 14:57:13 (MST)
Kim...You`re not the first one to tell me that, guy told me that one time while putting new tires on it for me. That it was really a 82 model, and they were changing the body style. He showed me on the tail lights that it had printed 82 on them. I got a Vette Head buddy that tells me that all the time. He`s got a 85 and a 66 and a 56 Corvettes. The 56 has a 283 engine in it I think, it`s a small V-8. My accident, I missed a V intersection, going to fast. I hit the meridian island and went airbourne 265 feet and hit three small trees while airbourne. It was in pieces when I landed, but the hood was stickin straight up. I had on my seat belt, but still I had hit the steering wheel and got a bunch of stiches in my head. I`ll have to check Wes out
Fred Skaggs
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 14:47:59 (MST)
Fred, Mobile 100...oops! My turn, Chevrolet suspended manufacture of Corvettes in 82, while they retooled for the C-4 models, they made some in late 83 as 84's, you may have had a classic on your hands, very few were sold in 83! I own a 76, a rolling restoration. had a 67, bought it in 75 for 2200 bucks, sold in in 76 for 3000. things go for 25 grand now!!! Night missions of any sort were a trip for me! Nothing like having a minigun open up alongside your leg to take away your night vision!!!Big ball of fire reaching up as far as the pilot's door, and curling back over the gun. It was amazing how much shit flew around in the ship when a rocket was punched off,and a hang fire in a lead ship looked like a JATO hookup, whole side of the bird looked like it was on fire!!!I never was very good in the night vision department and stuff like that just left me blind!!!! Freddie, check out Wes Griffith, he was there at that time. Good luck
Kim La Voie
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 14:16:26 (MST)
USA, MD USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 12:34:13 (MST)
Timeline...January 1971 thru June 1971...Does anyone remember Albert(Sancho)Sanchez, from San Antonio,Texas spent his first year as gunner and crew-chief with 2nd plt. Extended to be a crew-chief with the Cobra plt. A kid name Costello gunner with the Cobra plt. in that time frame. Also Wayne Middleton, from Texas, crew-chief with the Cobra plt. all in that time frame
Fred Skaggs <ac459429@earthlink.net>
Raleigh, NC USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 10:48:37 (MST)
The VA officer in Freeport, IL. told me that if you served in Viet Nam, Agent Orange exposure was automatically a given. So I don't think you even have to prove exposure, just time in country.
Ted Buisker <Skyking@stateline-isp.com>
Davis, IL. USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 10:00:40 (MST)
Oct67 to Sept68. As a pilot, I hated night formation too, we didn't do many, but they were always hairy. Usually led by an RLO who couldn't fly for crap. Remember one night CA, flight of about 10, all safety into the LZ, when a Major Groover (sp), flying chalk two, picked up for no real reason and hovered right into chalk one. Wiped out two aircraft. Then he figured he hadn't done enough damage for one day, so he got into chalk three and took over there. A--hole got a Silver Star out of the deal, should have been court-martialed. Night flare missions were another mission I could have done without. Remember as a newby dropping flares out of the clouds on a mission one night. Think it was with AC Tim Rudy, or Doug Marr. Came back down through the soup at the end of the mission with Bong Son approach control if I remember right. Found the sign that hung outside the place at a flea market. Hangs at the Pop-A-Top now. Drew spray missions early summer of 68, anyone remember the spray rig we had in a slick? , defoliated the roads southwest of Lane. Talk about agent Orange exposure, you'd come back with your clothes saturated, and the ship wet with the sh-t. The stuff we sprayed was in a blue barrel with a white stripe around the top. Talk about a shit-detail mission. Drew a resupply mission when the Typhoon went through south of us. Picked up a sling load at Tiger division resupply pad to take to an outpost to the south a ways. Noticed on our way south our ground speed was really picking up. Took about ten minutes flying time to get to the base. Turned into the wind for final approach, normally made at about 60 knots with a sling load, anyway we just sat there. finally had to go to 80Kts to get it to the point where the ROKs wanted it. Tents and things were blowing all over the place, and with the load on the ground the airspeed indicator was bouncing around the 60kt. mark. We headed north toward Lane, and it took us 45 mins to get back. On the way Ops suspended resupply operations. The revetments sat at 90 degrees to the wind, so we parked crosswise in the ones that were far enough apart. I think I was flying with Steve Grace that day. Later that afternoon the winds eased a bit and we flew Tiger wagon with General Chung. He wanted to go to a base in the mountains west of Lane, got into some of the damndest verticals I've ever been in. One minute we were at full power, climb attitude going down at a thousand feet a minute, next we had the needles almost split going UP 1500 ft a minute. The only time you saw the altitude you wanted was as you passed through it. One of the hairiest days of flying I ever had. Wish I could remember who crewed Tiger Wagon, seems to me the tail number was 905 or 902, something like that. I really wish I had gotten to know some of the crews better. I was always scared except when I was in the air, and usually had the runs, so I didn't spend as much time on the flight line as I should have.
Ted Buisker <Skyking@stateline-isp.com>
Davis, IL. USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 09:55:11 (MST)
AGENT ORANGE: Alvis and group, if you want to find more info on Agent Orange exposure, don't just count on the DOD or VA to verify it. Try searching on the Google search engine (www.google.com). Type in "agent orange" "NAME OF PLACE YOU WERE LOCATED", and be sure to use the quote marks. Here's an example of a hit on a search for Agent Orange use around Dong ba Thin (there are four pages of hits): "From Jerry Moore 577th Co.For those who are suffering from Agent Orange While the 577th was in Dong Ba Thin there were several sprayings of Agent Orange.From Aug.of 66 till Sept of 66.I have the print out from the Goverment.You can E-Mail me at jam1946@webtv.net"
Max Whittington <Max@OregonPI.com>
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 08:36:28 (MST)
Flight...You know me...I was bound and determine to find more history on the Mang Yang Pass. So I went to www.historynet.com and punched in the search engine for Mang Yang Pass, 383 articles relating to the subject. Actually the French Mobile unit was ambushed June 24, 1954 and it took the Viet Minh until June 27th before the French Unit "ceased to exist". Over 3,000 French soldiers were killed there. The French were not the only ones to have problems with that area 1st Cav, 4th Infantry and 173rd Airborne all paid their dues there. That was the reason LZ Blackhawk was put into place. I remember older pilots pointing Blackhawk when I was there. It was just a abandon base when I was there. I read that after the fall of South Viet-Nam in 1975, Uncle Ho`s boys went to the Pass and tore down all the cross`s that marked the graves of the Frenchmen. What a sad statement!!!! Go to that web-site and check it out.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 08:25:29 (MST)
morning flight, I have been reading the stories, and remembering, it is amazing any of us came back alive. some of the stuff we did was just crazyness. it was one thing to do things like that when we were doing a mission, but the things we did when we were off duty was just pure nuts .......... and fun LOL. about the pictures. I like the idea of a page with our "then" pic's, it would be neat to make it a then and now site with just our in-country dates and maybe our jobs posted. you don't want to get too generous with info. as for our MIA/KIA's I am working on just that page if you click on my name below you can go to the one I have now.it will give you an idea of what I am doing. but the new one will have pic's of the guys linked to them. so I would ask if you have any pics of them please send me one. I would like them in jpg format if you can. they download faster, but I can convert them if I get them in another format. I have only 4 right now so I have a ways to go before the page is ready to view. Later, Don
Don Miller <hogleg244@yahoo.com>
Valley Farms, AZ USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 08:16:49 (MST)
dont feel bed jim, i also had a pilot take off with me standing next to the bird,sill attached to the com. I had to hurry and make a jump for it,banging my knee on the skid or gun mount,cant remeber. Anyway, i was pissed. Told pilot what did he think he was doing, ..he lifted off without my clearing him and left me behind. Chuckle, now that i think about it, maybe he was trying to tell me something. Hot? summer? u guys dont know hot....was so hot here last summer...i saw a dog chasing a cat and both were walking.I remember that cause it was when i was fishing and cought a fish so big..the picture weighed 5 pounds. Jeff . i remember that story afout the mang yang pass also. Hey guys, question. when i went thru my agent orange exam years ago. I was ask if i had ever been exposed to it. My mind went to lz english and pictured all those bare assed,red hills ,devoid of anything green that towered over it. I told the guy asking the question," I dont know, but i was on a helicopter,flew into lots of places,crap would all swrill up as we landed and took off.Am i correct here in thinking we were exposed?Pleku and an khe also looked like they had been sprayed also. Used to have a shirt that said....sprayed and betrayed..vietnam vet. There any hats still out there for sale?or tee shirts? speaking of harleys,,i cant belive the prices. I had a 51 panhead,chopper in early 80s. Bought it for 12 hundred, rode it for years,put a small fortune in it,sold it (and took a month to do so) for 12 hundred, case of beer and a gram of coke.( i am clean for years now)I just saw some in paper for 12 to 14 thousand.Have people gone mad? well, my vacation is over and back to work for me today. Its so cold here now..i saw a lawyer with his hand in his own pocket
USA - Monday, February 03, 2003 at 05:59:39 (MST)
Bill, Sounds good to me, too, though I'd also like to add photos of some of our KIA guys. I put one of Mike Walker up on the online version of the Vietnam Memorial Wall, in the memories section. Also, I'd only put year of birth and age on the picture captions — too much info can be used by identity thieves.
Max Whittington <Max@OregonPI.com>
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 22:48:37 (MST)
Frenchie....you come up with some pretty good idea`s....yea I have no problem with that, see what Mark says.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 22:32:43 (MST)
I can't believe I've had a idea of this magnitude.... Would this be COOL.. Could we do it? OK Ok This is freakin brilliant... What if... We could all send in JPEG's of ourselves while in Nam. With dates and Ranks, ages Birthdays.... maybe what were are doing now... Kool? Can we do it ....? Maybe for the not so computer literate could send the old pictures, and someone could scan them..? If this would take to much space we could do Thumbs? Also could there be a search put into the archives so that we could find old facts and people? Mark, group, what da ya say? Alternative motive: Going to have a 53rd Birthday soon and want some recognition for still being on this earth this long, Go figure... Frenchie
Bill French <fren6222@bellsouth.net>
Savannah, Ga USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 22:15:50 (MST)
Kim LaVoie, thanks for the history on the Mang Yang Pass...where could find some reading or a web-site on that? Yes the 2nd platoon had VNAF pilots, about 4 or 5 PP`s. Damn I hated " tight flight formations" in the day. Leave alone the nightime flying. Nightime missions always gave me "sweaty palms" and "talkin to myself". Most of mine were flare missions.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 22:14:36 (MST)
Harley Guys.....I`ve never had one and never really wanted one...had a Volkswagen Van and the old 4 Cylinder LeMans in high school....after Nam I bought a 67 Stingray Corvette. I garaged it and bought a 1973 Firebird Formula 400 and from there I traded up for a 79 Trans Am Turbo. That Turbo was a headache, something always going wrong with it. In November of 1982 I traded my Stingray and Trans Am for a 1983 Corvette. Got married and the wife started on me...get rid of that Gas Hog Vette. December of 1985 I had a terrible wreck and totaled the Corvette. My wife said," You need a nice safe vehicle". So I bought a little Mazda pick-up truck. And I didn`t like the little truck, so in 1987 I bought a 4-Wheel drive Toyota pick-up. In 1989 I traded up to a newer Toyota 4x4 and drove it until the wheels were falling off. Then right before I retired I bought a new 1996 Dodge Dakota Sport. I still got it and it`s got less than 70,000 miles on it. But my wife had always had a BMW, the last one she had was a 1996. We sold that before we went to Europe and stored my Dodge. While in Europe we had a company car, Volvo stationwagon...since we have been back from europe we don`t really care about new cars and trucks. Guess you call that getting old and conservative. A Harley...shit...I`d would have killed myself on one of those. Down here they ride Harley`s with Izod shirts and Docker pants and Deck shoes.....very strange sight...that`s individualism.... Peter Fonda is nowhere to be found.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 22:01:09 (MST)
Max Whittington wrote: The major getting on the horn every now and then and snarling, "tighten it up!" made me think the pilots weren't all that hot about it, either. You're absolutly correct. I can't speak for all the other pilots but I absolutly hated night formations. There's times when your depth perception takes a dump and things weren't always as they seemed. There was only one thing worse. That's when they sent me back to Rucker to be an instructor and I had to do night formations with student pilots. You could almost wring out my flight suit after a night of that sort of things with newbie "not pilots yet."
Larry Kwiatkowski <chrger66@aol.com>
Simi Valley, Ca USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 21:26:38 (MST)
Smitty, try Maine in the summer..it's hotter than Death Valley in August, colder than Anchorage in the winter. June And July are just right. We have the UBM statewide late July, Laconia NH is in June.....gotta hand it to Harley Davidson...feed off the bad boy image, price the things so that it takes a lawyer's income to buy one...sell millions of scooters with everyone believing they're expressing their individuality! Ya, I own one too. thank god for customizing!!!!!snicker
Kim La Voie
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 19:07:01 (MST)
Sorry about that Fred I misread I thought you were going to 50 not 50 degrees. Hey Fred look at this way you might 2 birthday presents. HEHEHE
Rick England
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 18:51:18 (MST)
French Mobile 21...that was the convoy that got wiped out at Mang yang. they did everything wrong that could possibly be done...They were trying to lure the bad guys into a fight...On the other hand...at Cameron, Mexico, a detail got surrounded by the Mexican Army, fought them off for a day and a half, and fixed bayonets and charged when their ammo ran out, odds were about thirty to one. I've met enough cowardly, shitbum americans in my short life to know that individual bravery doesn't know a particular flag..I'm not sensitive because of my name...I'm more Irish than anything else. I've always wondered about Tony. The word was that he was a kit carson...how he ended up at Lane is beyond me. I doubt he got treated too good by his rescuer's. Kid coulod shoot pool. If I remember correctly, Ist flight had a table. Elmer Wood, e-5 Savannah Ga. took over 1st plt about time I went into the guns. he came with me from HAAF/ Ft. Stewart, Ga. to the 129th...Let's see.....Ft. Dix to Maguire...anchorage, Tan Son Nhut, Long Binh, Cam Ranh Bay, Tuy Hoa, Quin Nhon, then Lane.. I think I got to watch The Wild One, at Long Binh, went swimming at Cam Rhan, all while the Vietnamize were getting their asses kicked trying to cross the DMZ...didn't one of the slick platoon's have a VNAF pilot?
kim La Voie
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 18:47:49 (MST)
Fred Alvis.......Today your brithday???????just noticed that Rick England wished you Happy Brithday. Happy Brithday day Dude..........I noticed also that you had a incident with F-4, coming close to you. Something like that happen to me, the story is posted in the November 2001 Archives, Cups posted it for me...called "Sanpan Freddie". I had a bad habit of shooting at sanpans in "free fire" zones. F-4 came from nowhere and flew right under us. The IP Pilot( DiPiazza) thought I was shooting at the " Fast Mover", until he realized I was shooting at the sanpan. DiPiazza almost had a "heart attack" and didn`t want to fly with me any longer......almost got me kick off "flight status". And I wouldn`t be reassigned to maintenance......I was 05B20....Radio operator in the field. My butt would have been in the field. Of course DiPiazza was always a little "anal retentive".....Yea you "mess-up" in the 129th and some folks could be like the Japanese Culture....back away and act like they didn`t know your ass....disengage from any acknowledgement of your existence. But I had some good pilots and crewmembers who came to my rescue. I guess they could figured out that I was "so mature" at 19 years old. Jesus!!!! I was a kid. OH well ...just Groovin on a Sunday afternoon.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 15:14:09 (MST)
Two quotes I heard that you might find amusing: "Taking the French into battle is like taking an accordian: both are useless and noisy." And: "We need to have the French with us, they could teach the Iraqis how to surrender."
Max Whittington
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 13:44:42 (MST)
Animal....I wouldn`t worry to much about "brain cells", you`ve managed to make a good living and be able to live in Hawaii!!!! It`s not cheap to live there. That`s got to be great living there.....I`m gonna make it out there someday. Maybe go up in the moutains and look for some "Maui Wowie". Yea I`ve burnt some brain cells myself, but it hasn`t affected my memory that bad at all. I can remember things that happen to me when I was 2 years old.....guess I`m doin alright. Now if I could just remember where I put my car keys..... Keep login in Animal....maybe we can hook-up in islands. My wife would go there in a minute.....
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 13:39:18 (MST)
Fred, no mortars of any 129th position that I heard about during my June '66-March '67 tour. Prior to the 1967 Tet truce (Feb 8—Feb 12), most of the prisoners we were bringing in were pretty ragged, with old weapons and little in the way of food or ammo. During the truce we were at Bao Loc and Phan Thiet, and, despite bad weather, we spent the truce flying observation missions between the coast and the Cambodian border. We watched Charlie resupply the whole area, mostly by forced labor (Montagnards) and using sampans and barges on the larger rivers. A number of our ships tried to get Charles to fire, so they could destroy the boats ("rules of engagement" during the truce), but he usually just grinned and waved. By the last day Chuck had moved thousands of tons of supplies (including, we can assume, mortars and shells) all the way from the border to the coast. After that, things got hotter. I DEROSed the next month, but expect we all paid the price for President Johnson's attempts to placate Uncle Ho. (The night of the end of the truce my ship and one other sat in the support area for a Special Forces team that was in a small compound, advising CIDG troops. The Americans were pleading to be pulled out, as the camp had been surrounded during the truce, and the Vietnamese friendlies had indicate they weren't going to stick around. Even though we had thick fog, my AC said we would make an attempt to extricate them, but their headquarters refused permission, several times. Right at midnight, all transmissions from the camp stopped. We had to fly somewhere else, but the next day I heard that another ship went in and removed five Americans bodies from the now empty camp. No CIDG or VC bodies were found.)
Max Whittington <Max@OregonPI.com>
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 13:38:52 (MST)
Smitty, Here's the tale of your unusual flight. I remember it because you were still wide eyed and shaken up and had to tell someone about it. You were crewing with Cobra Knight, I believe, (he was also the Maintenance officer and that's why he was in a slick). You guys were on the ground with the ship at flight idle, and you had climbed on top, opened an access panel and were checking/adjusting/doing whatever a good CE would do up there with the ship running. Maybe you had a new gunner with you, but the AC decided to take off; said: "clear up?" the gunner said "clear up" and away you went still sitting on top of the helicopter. After a few seconds they were alarmed by a banging sound on the ship and did a precautionary landing, allowing you to quickly dismount. Shaken, but not stirred. I swear I remember this like it was yesterday, but as previously stated, many of my brain cells have been sacrificed to the beer gods over the years. Do you remember this? Am I nuts? I think I promised not to tell anyone about it, but it came to me clear as a bell after I found this website and the statute of limitations has run out on riding helicopters bareback. Best wishes Animal.........Dave P: Thanks for the Pics, I'd love to show any of you guys around Hawaii.
HI USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 12:27:22 (MST)
The way I understand the Meng Yang is the French did lose a large scale battle there. But as history whre didn't the french get theur "clocks cleaned" ? HE-HE. Anyway if you remember when you flew over it you could see all these little indentations in the ground. I was told by an old timer when I was a newbie that they were graves and the dead had been burried standing up facing France. That is a reach-but who knows.
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 12:09:59 (MST)
Flight.....Talking about An Khe Pass.......what was the history on the Mang Yang Pass....French got their "clocks clean" up there or something like that.
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 10:42:56 (MST)
Good Moning Flight, Kim L......When I was flying....some guys well tell you...10 or 12 hour days wasn`t uncommon. An Khe was a huge base, 4th Infantry was there and Air force was there. Pleiku was huge.... They had a big population of Air Force and 4th Infantry headquarters. 5th Special Forces was there, plus several helicopter units operated out of there. Dak To was what surprized me....there was just a refueling point and that was it...nothing else. It would freak me out to land and refuel in the middle of nowhere!!!!! They could have just blowed us away. Mark......Tony Adams.....when some of the fellas talk about other units they were with.....I sometimes will go to that web-site just to see how things was with them....Jim W. mentioned the 120th AHC and I just surfed in to check it out. There it was....Tony Adams...Coldwater, Ohio. He was a Avionics person, that was high tech stuff then....Tony had to a pretty smart guy. But settling in to be a farmer that`s neat. Small world.....there`s a guy named Kevin White that was with the 48th AHC Bluestars....Kevin and I played basketball in high school against each other....would run into each other in Nam( Cheo Reo)....... then we would come home and both end up working for the City of Columbus, Ohio....he became a Supervisor and I became a Chief Union Steward and we would have to work together on displinary hearings and so forth. Plus I was in maintenance in Parks and Recreation and he was a Maintenance Supervisor for City Hall. If I needed a part for something and couldn`t get it...I`d call Kevin...he retires in April of 2005. He had kids in college so he stayed a little longer. Space Shuttle....I don`t know what to say......maybe we need to take some of that money we`re injecting into the war efford and build new stuff....that shuttle was over 20 years old. Maybe a new air frame design, something!!!!! But I`m not a expert...so I don`t know. Going back to something I was saying before.....It appears that other units had to deal with being mortared and rocket attacks on their base camps. An Son it seems we lived pretty safe.....down at Phu Hiep we were hit 5 times in 2 months, and they had Koreans around them. Shit the Koreans would get hit. Tuy Hoa air force base would get hit. We lived pretty safe at Lane.... Maybe some of the older fellas got hit at Lane....early on did the older fellas get mortared?
Fred Skaggs
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 09:45:23 (MST)
Happy Birthday and many more Mr. Alvis You youngin
Rick England
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 09:44:44 (MST)
.........Animal.........good to see you here..........Jim W......I thought that Freddie Boy said you mentioned Tony Adams to him???...Maybe I am confused. Hey Freddie Boy, So how did you come up with the name of Tony Adams>?.....as I said befor, I do know a Tony A. from this AO and he is a Nam Vet......Hum......can you give me a heads up on that?......take care all...Sunday.....day off for me......God Bless the Shuttle crew and their families......Oh, I forgot to tell you all about the POW/MIA black out yesterday of the page. Hope you did not mind......always a brother...........Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 09:43:06 (MST)
Amid this tragic time, I humbly submit a little humor. A GIRLS PRAYER Lord, Before I lay me down to sleep, I pray for a man, who's not a creep, One who's handsome, smart and strong, One who's loves to listen long, One who thinks before he speaks, When he says he'll call, he won't wait weeks. I pray that he is gainfully employed, And when I spend his cash, he won't be annoyed. Pulls out my chair and opens my door, Massages my back and begs to do more. Oh! send me a man who'll make love to my mind, Knows what to answer to "How big's my behind?" One who'll make love till my body's a'twitchin, In the hall, in the garden and in the kitchen! I pray that this man will love me to no end, And never attempt to hit on my friend. A GUY'S PRAYER: Lord, I pray for a nympho with huge boobs who owns a liquor store and likes to fish. Amen This was sent to me. Be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 09:40:21 (MST)
hey jim,mark. Was talking to a fellow the other day and he said something that might intrest u both. he said he had mounted one of those GPS thingies on his bike so if anyone steals it,he ,or cops, can find the bike quickly.perhaps he was lying to me but sounded good.If I understood correctly,he said it was a fairly simple system to hook up.Jim, you are welcome here anytimePerhaps you can make it for the good guy nationals..nothing but hot rods and customs.Magizine quality discribes many of them.As i live on main street ,here in clermont,on the side going towards the track,just b4 a red light,they stack up out side my front door.Whoo Hoo, going to be in the 50s today. chuckle all take care,god bless.
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 09:39:20 (MST)
I agree with others in here, night flying with tight formations scared the crap out of me. Yes animal, I think that was a mission i was on.An Khe pass always made me nervous,always.Looking at all the aircraft carcasses laying down there,wondering what their stories were,and it was a "in your face" reminder just how close to the edge we really were.Yes, the ever changing cealing at the pass kept ones attention level high.Smile, tree top flyibg was fun up the song be river. i remember every time we surprised villagers washing and swimming,they would all run for cover as if we were after them.I still chuckle over that.I rememberflying into phu cat.low cealing,and a fox 4 came down thru the clouds,appearing as if by magic,about 1/2 mile away,flying pararellto us. Told the A.C. we had a fast mover at 3 o'clock..chuckle,bet his eyes popped out.Those air force types there sure had it good.I think we used to call them wing wipers.brrr. never was so cold as flying in the monsoons.I didnt like flying with the doors shut,but i hated flying wet and cold worse.Was so bad once,the pilots told us to stick out heads out the doors to make sure we didnt hit any towers or such.We were some where near the bottom of the an khe pass,up some other vally,no friendly place to set down with miles.Oh, I was there sometime in mid augest to early jan.Was then sent to 60th after Gabbys screw up,if it can be called that.I do remeber the pilot getting busted for drying pot.Anyone remember going to find the civilan aircraft that crashed and burnt atop mountian next to Quin hon?Was 30 or 40 torn up bodies, all in front of the burnt aircraft.Just the tail section was left and the tips of the wings.The people were torn apart like a terrier on rag dolls, plus some were burnt black.They almost cleared the mountian top.
USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 09:30:16 (MST)
Animal; somehow the story on top of the aircraft slips my mind, help me if you can. Mark & Fred, I was in the 120th in 1969 & the 129th in 71-72 so I wouldn't know Tony but would like to meet him. GOD DAMN IT, MY ELECTRA GLIDE is coming in in a month or so & I am going to figure out a way to Ride back east & meet some of you if it kills me & it may. I want to see tha Bar Mark, I want to see Fred Alvis, meet some of the rest of you & maybe go all the way to the wall. I got missed on the vacation time to go to the reunion so I can't. The leave time I could get was later in July but that's the Govt for you. By the way Fred Skaggs, Festus also has a picture of the .50 cal hanging on the H Model, It can be done but cracking the Gun mounts is a concern. Love to you all, Jim W
Jim Westwang <westwang@attbi.com>
sheridan, Wy. USA - Sunday, February 02, 2003 at 09:11:45 (MST)
PEMBROKE, GA USA - Saturday, February 01, 2003 at 07:37:01 (MST)
My time on flight status in the 129 began in July,71 and ran till dec.19,71. I have my flight records from that time. It would have been nice to have the missions written down, along with the hours flown. Good thing about the gun's, our formation flying was with plenty of separation!!!!! We got socked in and spent the night at Anh Khe once. The Cav guys from the area can't believe it when I tell them it was just an outpost, in 71. nearly deserted! it wasn't a very fun night, for sure..........I was involved in a few 8 hour days, but, for the most part, our time in the air was a couple hours a day, max. I know that one of the long days was flying as gunner on a slick one day, just to get away from home for a while. it was an ass and trash day, crank up, go to QuiNhon get the mail, go to Phu Cat for coffee, Bong Son, drop off stuff for the grunts at some Lz's, back to resupply the Korean outposts, low level down the Son Be river....mind numbing stuff....I got a new respect for the slick types after that...going from delivery truck to a one ship CA, all in one day!!!!! A couple notes on riccochets. One, I think I started a major sweep one day, inland from Tuy Hoa. We were cover for a snoopy mission, and were on a crosswind leg when snoopy low reported a hot spot near a hootch. WE were a couple thousand feet from them, and I opened up with the sixty, firing under snoopy low, next thing I hear, they're reporting taking fire!WE had a fun time, firing up who knows what, Korean grunts made a CA there.....never did hear if they found anything....Another time, we were using a sand spit, just north of QuiNhon, as a free fire zone. WE were turning outbound after a run, and our trail ship went in hot. A rocket hit just under us, and a little fragment came rising up at us, ever soooo slowly, it never got bigger, at least in my mind, it just kept coming up, closer and closer...Damn thing went through my pantleg and logded in the transmission panel. Made a neat little scar on my leg, about two inches below my bag!! I'll never know how many close calls we had, but for me, the worst times were inflicted by our friends...nearly getting run down by a C-119 while crossing Phu Cat airspace, Korean mortar rounds exploding under us while flying convoy cover at the Anh khe pass. Getting shot at was easy...you could fight back!
Kim La Voie
Me USA - Saturday, February 01, 2003 at 07:22:03 (MST)
Animal, am I the only one who was scared spitless of flying tight formations at night? Sometimes it seemed like the next ship's blades were going to come right into my hellhole and cut me in half. Blades overlapping, and every time we hit an up or down draft I just knew my momma was going to soon be getting a big insurance check from the Army. Only times I ever even thought it would be nice to have a parachute. The major getting on the horn every now and then and snarling, "tighten it up!" made me think the pilots weren't all that hot about it, either. I'd take a hot extraction of a blown LRRP squad before night formations, any time!
Max Whittington <Max@OregonPI.com>
USA - Saturday, February 01, 2003 at 01:50:13 (MST)
......Freddie Boy.......Golly, gee wizz.........Tony Adams???????....what a small friggin' world!!!!!!!!!!..Hell yes I know Tony Adams.........we used to go to church together at a small Lutheran churck just west of town here. Out on the Wabash river...........do you mean that Jim W. as in Westwang mentioned Tony to you????......I did not know that Tony was a Nam Vet until I started all this research about Larry. I wasnt until then that his name came up. Knew his mom and dad also...........I think he still lives on the Home place west of town. Has always been a quite guy.........used to see him out on the tractor in the field with his long beard and ball cap on just tillin' the earth.......he and Larry would of been in Sunday School together out at the church......gee wizz??????????what a small friggin' world we live in.......Hey Jim W..........have you made contavt with Tony in a spell????. I can get a hold of him if you like????????????...........lost slepp tonight.........mixed a stiff one.....and just watched the show when Mike and Gloria moved out to CA away from Archie and Edith...........man........dumb me.,set here with tears in my eyes.............got ghost of my own in my head that I cant shake late at night also... ...........gee wizz...............Tony Adams..............what a small friggin' world it is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!................good como in here.................glad that it keeps goin''''''''''''''''''''whopps, makin' a few mistakes..............hey J.W Wilson......Welcome hame and back to the 129th..........stay active in the Flight Log Book........looks as if some recall you already...........correct typin' and spellin' is not the norm here.........type away pal......I will make sure that your e-mail address goes in the contacts section, if you wish!!!!!!!!..........amazin''''''''''Tony Adams, a ole friend of mine, was a friend of another from out of the blue that just happins to be on this page also...........amazin''''''''''''''''''''''''best hit the rack......know that I will have a sloppy, drink spilled, messed up floor, to mop in the mornin'............Take care my brothers and sisters.....................I WASNT THERE, BUT I STILL CARE, ABOUT ALL OF YOU...........always a brother..............Night Larry................Mark
Mark Jackson <fourfour@bright.net>
USA - Saturday, February 01, 2003 at 00:40:50 (MST)